Danzo + Weber = car no run!

[danzo]

Looking for some suggestions from the good Weber peeps here, I'm starting to get frustrated.

About 6 weeks ago my T4 stopped running at work. Towed it home and put 'er in the garage, I did notice the float bowl in the stock carb was dry. I figured maybe a bad fuel pump/clogged line, put it on the backburner since I was busy with the holidays and family stuff.

Yesterday I slapped on the Weber/ FP regulator after verifying the fuel pump was OK (now thought maybe the Aisin had a stuck float) and it cranked but didn't start. No fuel at the carb no matter what the reg was set on, so I removed the Spectre FP reg and guess what - gobs o' fuel! So I ran a line directly from the pump to the carb (not sure if this will hurt the carb), I thought I had it figured out but it still won't start. Fuel squirting in the barrels, plugs wet, good spark, compression should be OK (don't have gauge handy). I just don't understand it.

Maybe I hooked up the vaccuum lines wrong and thus have a big leak? The bottom vac line from the dizzy now goes to the carb since this advances the spark (can hear it move), the other two dizzy ports I plugged. Does this line need a check valve? The PCV valve and other valve cover breather are plugged temporarily. The two line vac port at the front of the manifold is plugged, and I can't see any other possible leak sources.

Is there something I should do to the Weber before installation? Call me dumm but I literally took it out of the box and installed it without any adjustments. Do I need to turn some screws? Just trying to brainstorm.

Thanks for any help, I can't wait to get it running.

[dlb]

was it running fine up until you went to leave work? no symptoms before it started acting up?

are the TSVS ports blocked? probably, you just didn't mention them so i thought i should ask. the timing advance line does not need a check valve.

[danzo]

It ran fine right up until it sputtered a few times, it ran another mile or two then I parked it at work. Came back out a few minutes later and it wouldn't start. I assumed this is what happens when the float bowl gets drained.

No I don't have the TVSV ports blocked. Why would this need to be done? They don't connect to anything, so I plan to install a mech water temp gauge in it's place. I guess I'll hook up the dizzy advance line tomorrow morning without the check valve and try it again. Thanx DLB.

[ARCHINSTL]

There are schools of thought on the dist/vac setups...
Is the EGR vac piping plugged?
Some on other boards have mentioned probs with the Spectre regulator - I used a Holley, per splatterdog's advice.
Re the Weber - did you do the lean drop method as mentioned in the instructions? Maybe the idle mixture screw was way out of adjustment? Mine pretty much ran right out of the box, although that screw had to be adjusted.
Tom M.

[danzo]

The vac ports on the EGR are plugged. My carb didn't come with instructions but I do have a Weber tuning book. I didn't adjust anything, just installed the welded Aisin bellcrank and bolted 'er on. Even if the carb is way rich it seems to reason the car would at least try to start. It doesn't even catch for a few combustion cycles. Nonetheless I'll mess with the mixtrure setting and report back. Thanks for the input, Tom.

[deejay1272]

Don't forget to adjust the high speed idle screw either. That can make a huge difference.

Don't trust the screw settings when you pull it out of the box. My settings were totally jacked and I had to tune and adjust for several days before hitting the sweet spot.

I added some instructions about this stuff here:

http://www.tercel4wd.com/forums/viewtop ... f=7&t=6009

Note - the photos in this thread are out of date (I have since connected dist vac advance to the gas filter). Be sure to plug all of your unused vac ports to track down any potential vacuum leaks.

[Petros]

can you get it to run with some fuel splashed down the carb? or starting fluid? Could be it stopped running for a reason unrelated to the carb, so you need to still do a full diagnosis.

On an asside to consider, I could not get fuel to the fuel pump once because the rubber hose over by the fuel filter (up stream of the fuel pump) had a leak that caused it to suck air. Easy fix, but finding the problem was another matter.

[keith]

I have to agree with Petros, the problem is elsewhere. You might have skipped a tooth on the timing belt or the distributor jumped time. Sounds like you have all the components, but not all in the right sequence.

[danzo]

can you get it to run with some fuel splashed down the carb? or starting fluid? Could be it stopped running for a reason unrelated to the carb, so you need to still do a full diagnosis.

It won't catch even with carb spray. Years ago I put a Weber on my Triumph and it wouldn't start at all due to massive vac leak. But that's not the case here so I'm kinda stumped.

Forgive my tardiness - I've been away from the car and the internet. It's like I was Buck Rogers in suspended animation, or maybe just stuck in Kansas. At any rate I'll resume checking on things tomorrow, beginning with a comp check. Thanks for the help.

[danzo]

The frustration continues. Here's what I found today:

- Compression is between 155-180 cold so I think I can rule out a skipped t-belt. I replaced it a few months ago with a new tensioner.
- I hooked the dizzy advance to 'port vac' on the carb so it advances only when throttle is opened (verified by vac gauge)
- The cranking vac is ~4" on a cheap gauge. It noticeably drops when throttle is opened so I guess there are no major vac leaks.
- While cranking the timing light fired at 0* TDC, which is what I drove it on previously. I adjusted this to 10* but it made no diff.
- The PCV and other valve cover breather are plugged, but it doesn't make any diff if I unplug them.

How do you perform the initial mixture adjustment? Could this prevent the car from starting if it's too far off? Wouldn't think so.

As always feel free to make suggestions/fling insults. Tomorrow I plan to reinstall the phenolic spacer so I can hook the PCV valve to it, but this prolly won't make any difference. Then maybe I'll force Manny Moe and Jack to replace my brand new nonfunctional fuel press regulator. I know the Weber will run with the stock pressure, but what the heck.

[deejay1272]

How do you perform the initial mixture adjustment?

Mixture screw:

Redline says to turn the mixture screw all the way in (clockwise) until it seats. Be very careful when doing this so that you don't bend or otherwise mutilate the brass screw -- you should seat it very gently. After you've done this, back it out about two turns and treat this as your starting point.


Fast Idle Screw:

Screw this one in (clockwise) a few times and treat this as the starting point as well. Stomp on the gas once or twice before attempting to start the car to engage the choke cam.

Try these two things before installing the phenolic spacer....I don't think this is your problem.

[ARCHINSTL]

As deejay1272 mentioned, but make sure the engine is warm.
Tom M.

[Petros]

did you have the distributor out for any reason? Could the spark be 180 deg off? It should start at 0 deg, or 5 or 10 deg.

All of the things you noted would not keep it from starting, you are looking in the wrong places.

There are only two reasons it will not run, no fuel or no spark (or no spark at the right time). It should start and run, even badly, with a mixture way off, unless it is way too rich for some reason (spark plugs will be wet with fuel). I do not imagine it is too lean because it would have started and run momentarily with the starter spray you tried. If it is flooded, take out the spark plugs and crank it a few times to let it air out for a few min, and than put them back. Check you have a strong bluish white spark at the plug, and the spark plug wires connected are on the correct spark plugs (I messed this up once, it is very embarrassing when you find out). It might be a coincident that something in the inision system when bad when you swaped the carb, but that does not seem likely. There is something wrong with the carb most likely, verify you are getting fuel to it, and the float works, etc. so you are not flooding it.

The weber is a simple and rugged carb, been used for decades, and unless there is something really wrong with it internally, should start and run even if too lean or too rich. Most come with jets too rich for out engine, but it should still start. There was a thread about weber jets, if you suspect mixture is way off check your jet sizes as noted in the weber thread.\

Good luck.

[danzo]

So my car did run briefly today! After removing the plugs and cranking the motor to 'air out the cylinders' it did run, so I seized the oppourtunity to adjust the timing/idle. Initially I thought I had the problem solved, but it wouldn't restart.

As it turns out Petros guessed correctly. Long story short - the ignition is firing the plugs intermittently as verified by my timing light and exposing plugs.

This is my second ignition failture in 2 years, is there a better system to swap in? I'm not too keen on installing 25 year old ignition components again.

[rer233]

i've good luck going to the boneyard and pulling distributors from chevy novas (same car as corolla only more plentiful and cheaper.) everything bolts right up- only difference is the angles on the vacuum advance ports (easily fixed by lenghting the rubber vacuum hoses.) also, i think toyota had a recall on the early 3 and 4ac igniters- just another reason to go with the nova dist (i think they were made thru '89 or so.) it's a lot cheaper and easier to replace the whole dist than trying to play guessing games with individual components. good luck- glad to see you found the REAL problem (thanks to petros and the other guys on this forum!)