Can you guys help me figure out what's best?

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Sun May 23, 2004 1:38 pm

Ok, as you guys may have known I'll no longer be able to get the 85, but I'm positive that one day I'll find a fully optioned 87 silver SR5 that I have always longed for. Now I'd better get the 83 up and running soon because I've been waiting 4 years already to have some real fun with it. Ever since we got it almost 7 years (we got it in June of '97) ago I've wanted to check out how good it really is in snow and in mud which I had heard much about.

It's been through one engine, 2 rebuilt carbs, one being horrible, a pair of struts, brakes, 2 brake discs, water pump, fuel pump, oil pan on previous engine, 2 radiators, 1 clogged fuel filter, 1 alternator, 3 used tires, 1 new tire from a set, and a set of belts. That's as good as I remember. Oh yeah it was bought with 159,000 American miles.

Now it has 223,500 something miles and there are some awful noises that I can't identify. The clutch is almost if it is, gone. You really have to push the clutch pedal all the way in otherwise it will keep shuddering in gear. The A/C never worked ever though sometimes I wish it really worked when it's 95+ degrees here. I want to get that working, too. The carpet definitely needs to be replaced as I mentioned in a previous thread. The headliner is in need to be replaced as well, but for now I'm only interested in it running. The engine is in bad shape with the compression readings being #1 115, #2 105, #3 115, and #4 115. About 2-3 years ago it would smoke clouds of smoke upon acceleration, but adding Bardahl cured it so that it would smoke considerably less. The wheel bearings in the rear are bad as you can hear it.

I have to do my homework; I'll post the rest of this when I get a chance.

takza · Post by **takza** » Mon May 24, 2004 5:17 am

All I can say is that the car would be good to practice on as far as learning to work on cars....not so sure I'd recommend the mechanics life though. It's a good thing to know how to do the basics though.

Sounds like the rings are gone, but you might be able to fiddle with the clutch cable to help that problem.

You can use some heavy wire to shim the length of the clutch cable at both ends and/or you can adjust the clutch at the sector and pawl under the dash.

You might get it driveable...but I'd say the engine will need replacing or rebuilding eventually.

Go borrow a manual at the local library and start learning about the car by trying to fix some things? :huh:

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Tue May 25, 2004 8:46 am

takza wrote:All I can say is that the car would be good to practice on as far as learning to work on cars....not so sure I'd recommend the mechanics life though. It's a good thing to know how to do the basics though.

Sounds like the rings are gone, but you might be able to fiddle with the clutch cable to help that problem.

You can use some heavy wire to shim the length of the clutch cable at both ends and/or you can adjust the clutch at the sector and pawl under the dash.

You might get it driveable...but I'd say the engine will need replacing or rebuilding eventually.

Go borrow a manual at the local library and start learning about the car by trying to fix some things? :huh:

Yes, I agree that's why I want it so badly- well come to think about it, if I were to have gotten the 85 I probably would of have to have given the 83 up, and that sacrifice I wasn't willing to make. Plus to many adventures piled up on this car anyway.

I wouldn't like the life of a mechanic, although I would like to be able to fix my Tercels though. I want to pursue the life of an engineer.

I think it's through with the adjusting... when my dad barely drove it of the lot the clutch pedal started to make "clacking" noises. It now slips and takes a while to grab, too. All that shuddering makes me nervous, I'm afraid something much worse is going to happen to it if I don't do something about it.

There is a problem that I just don't get what it is and that is that when it's parked for a while (a week maybe) and then you're going to move it from one side of the street to the other then you literally have to really shove it into 2nd and then into 1st. It seems like if it were to get stuck in between the gears and then when it does go in then it shudders pathetically. Then it almost always grinds in reverse, 3A-C Power told me it was that the clutch was sticking. Then before when you would be going uphill in 5th and you were climbing and attempted to shift into 4th either you would simply not be able to or it would grind and then you would have to shift into 5th again or simply it would not shift at all for a couple of seconds. What could this mean? Then I see tranny oil- like a drop, but not sure if it continually drips or what. When you're in 5th in the freeway and it sort of gets steep it will start to slow down and sounds like it's working harder, but it wasn't like that before and on more than one occasion it has smelled like tranny oil.

As for the manual I have checked the FSM for it from the library since 5th grade (1999-2000) and I can't say I understood it back then. I've also requested the Bentley manual and I find it much more useful than the others, and I've also checked out the Chilton's, not as good though. Won't really learn unless I do things to it, which is what I plan to do soon so that I can go have some real fun with my brother and cousin (he's a year younger than I am so that's the perfect person to go fool around with a Tercel, especially where he lives).

I'm not done yet describing the life of the 83 yet so stay tuned! I'm at school and the bell's about to ring so I'll try to finish it later. Thanks for the help.

B)

Thereminator · Post by **Thereminator** » Tue May 25, 2004 7:07 pm

Carlos,your Clutch and Preasure~plate are gone...Gone....GONE!!! Time to Read~up and know the clutch~replacement procedure by Heart so all the tool,work~area,and Labor planing(whos helping) can be planed~out. It is possible to understand how each and every part of your car works by reading about it.It will take imagination and effort and it will be Very~Rewarding to know that you can fix almost everything on you car!

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Tue May 25, 2004 7:30 pm

Now I have questions about the engine. Why after it was smoking it barely smokes anymore? Even the spark plugs don't show any sign of it smoking. I guess putting that 20W-50 oil with the Bardahl really does help as far as I know. I want to try the approach that Sascha used in the previous board and that is to simply just replace the head with another one. Is it worth it? I want to just replace the clutch first and see what else it might need. I was just thinking of just replacing the valve cover gasket and see how it does uphill. If the performance is unbearable then I'll have to simply replace the head.

Now for the clutch- is a Rhino Pac clutch kit any good? I think that was the cheapest clutch kit I could find at carparts.com. Are there any cheaper ones? I will have to get the flywheel turned and then see what's up in that area too so I will have an idea. Is there any chance that I could do the clutch with another friend using just the manuals? I've heard that the shuddering can cause some damage to the flywheel.

I will need to do the front and rear suspension. I'll I have to do is pop the strut cartridge inside, right? As for the rear that might be a little on the difficult side for me. I think that the rear ones have never been replaced. I saw the front ones being replaced one time, but thank goodness you guys have a write-up on that plus the help from the manual. Besides I don't think the way the guy took out the struts was right and I think that something could get damaged that way. I plan to replace them with KYB ones. I asked my friend mechanic if those were any good and he said that they were good, I guess I'll know when I put them in.

In the rear axle there is a seal leak in the left side or shaft. The wheel bearings are definitely gone. How do you replace those? Does it require any special tools?

The carburetor is to my opinion not right and I want to rebuild it. What is best, should I buy the kit ($25) or should I just leave it alone? I guess it's something to do with the choke, but I think oil has made its way in there so I would like to take it apart and rebuild it.

Speaking of wheel bearings I need to do the brakes, too! The front ones are starting to dust and I don't want it to get to the point that they start to grind the rotors. The rear drum I think are done for because I hear some grinding/groaning noises back there.

I'll go over my list and see what I'm missing and post it, that way when the time comes I'll know exactly what to buy and replace. I'm very excited to start! Don't know how soon though.

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Tue May 25, 2004 7:31 pm

Thereminator wrote: Carlos,your Clutch and Preasure~plate are gone...Gone....GONE!!! Time to Read~up and know the clutch~replacement procedure by Heart so all the tool,work~area,and Labor planing(whos helping) can be planed~out. It is possible to understand how each and every part of your car works by reading about it.It will take imagination and effort and it will be Very~Rewarding to know that you can fix almost everything on you car!

Yes, yes!! You're absolutely right! I'll see what happens after I replace the clutch.

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:53 am

I have had two other people test drive it and they told me that it could probably be the engine/trans mounts, I'm talking about the shaking on takeoff. I still don't know; would like some opinions.

takza · Post by **takza** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 5:26 am

As far as the clutch & shfting...my Tercel was sort of similar when I bought it because it had sit somewhere undriven for a good while. After I started driving it regularly, the clutch improved to the point that it is now 99%. Also, putting the oil in the shifter area helped a lot.

If heavy oil and Bardahl have helped the engine that much....you should be able to find something to unstick those rings and maybe get by drivng it that way.

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 12:09 pm

Well after the battery died, and my dad and I had to push it, there's something I want to confirm. We tried to push start it (not good) and it would just shake with the clutch engaged. We got it in the driveway and in its parking spot and when he came back to move it again (a good 8-9 hours later) it started right up. That was weird. Then I noticed that there was a pretty good amount of clear stuff that was on the floor. It looked like it was oil. I'm going to check today and if it's still there then it was transmission oil because the other car that sits there doesn't leak any oil so it'll have to be the Tercel. Is the transmission probably not going to last any longer if I replace the engine someday? Would it be cheaper to remove it and replace the seals or just get a used one? Oh, and it's not a good idea to tell your dad that the old Tercel is dying because then he'll start thinking of getting rid of it. About 4-5 days later we tried starting it but the battery was totally dead, so now it has a rebuilt battery.

russkiypenguin1 · Post by **russkiypenguin1** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:10 pm

Clear fluid on a vehicle that old doesn't make any sense. Technically brake fluid is usually the clearest of all fluids. But in an older car it usually becomes colored.

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 4:46 pm

I figured out that it wasn't oil, otherwise it would still be there and its not. Must of been water when the carb backfired. There's something weird going on, because I think there might be water accumulated somewhere because under hard acceleration, 3-4k rpm, rusty water sometimes comes out of the tailpipe.

I don't think it was brake fluid because this car's brake fluid has yellow-green tint to it. I really should replace it.

russkiypenguin1 · Post by **russkiypenguin1** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 7:58 pm

Actually water coming out of the tailpipe is completely normal. If it didn't come out your muffler would rust out in no time. And you could have had water stashed in body panels any ol' where, so I wouldn't worry so much about that.

Teddy1 · Post by **Teddy1** » Sun Dec 19, 2004 9:58 am

Carlos:

You have MULTIPLE issues, here.

In order:

1. Your clutch/throwout bearing/expansion plate/flywheel are done, as someone else mentioned. You need new ones. Do NOT go buy the "cheapest" clutch kit you can find... 3 months later after installing it, you will HATE yourself. The ONLY clutch kits worth purchasing are the Beck-Arnley kit from Napa, or the Toyota factory clutch kit. Trust me on this. The flywheel should be sand blasted first, then spray painted with high temp header paint, and then taken to a machinist to be turned. Actually, take it to the machinist FIRST, and have him measure it, to make sure it's not past it's limits. If he says the flywheel is ok, then, get it sandblasted, then paint it, then take it back to him to be turned. Also, buy new flywheel bolts from Toyota. Don't reuse the old ones. I will not even discuss or argue the merits of reusing flywheel bolts (they are "stretch bolts", that physically change length the FIRST time they are torqued into place). Also, remember to use a liquid threadlocker on those bolts.

2. Above your clutch pedal is a white plastic sprocket/gear assembly... this is the much loved/hated Toyota self adjusting clutch cable system (in lieu of a hydraulic system). You will want to replace this assembly. You will also want a new clutch cable, you can buy it at Napa.

3. To do the clutch job, you will be removing the engine. This is an EXCELLENT time to change the rear main seal on the back of the block. Be assured that if you DON'T replace that rear main seal, it will blow out 3 months later, splashing oil all over your new clutch/expansion plate assembly, completely ruining them, requiring you to do the job AGAIN.

4. With the engine out, it is also an excellent opportunity to change your motor mounts (2) and the transmission mount. These can be purchased from Napa. Note that often the ones from Napa use SAE fasteners (instead of metric), so be sure to check your hardware... after installing the Napa motor mounts and tranny mounts, you may need to go purchase some SAE grade 8 nuts and bolts.

5. A good way to flush your transmission is to drain the oil out of it, and then refill with Marvel Mystery Oil... drive the car about 500 feet with the Marvel Mystery Oil in the transmission, then pull back into your driveway and dump the stuff. Refill with Amsoil synthetic.

6. As mentioned in other postings, Seafoam is basically magic. You can run it in your case with the oil, and run it in your gas. Really, Seafoam, Marvel Mystery Oil and Amsoil's MP and Power Foam products are the holy grail of engine chemicals.

7. As mentioned by russkiypenguin, water coming out of your tailpipe is COMPLETELY normal... exhaust systems store water due to condensation, heating/cooling of the exhaust tract, etc. Ignore this phenomenae.

8. There is nothing wrong with Kayaba shocks, however... for THAT much money, you could probably install air shocks in place of the factory cartridges. The $10 Monroe and Gabriels last about half as long as the high pressure Kayaba shocks... if you can find the LOW pressure KYBs for a reasonable price, they would be a hot ticket.

9. You will want the Toyota Factory Service Manual, to work on your car. Rebuilding the carb, replacing the clutch, installing new wheel bearings... ALL of these are properly documented in the shop manual. This book should be your Bible, as far as the Tercel is concerned. Avoid the Chilton's manuals.

- Teddy

3A-C Power · Post by **3A-C Power** » Sun Dec 19, 2004 10:42 am

Have you had good experience with Amsoil in the tranny?

Teddy1 · Post by **Teddy1** » Sun Dec 19, 2004 2:15 pm

3A-C Power,

Generally speaking, I have had AWESOME experience with Amsoil, period.

And, it's a natural for trannies, since it's pour point (the temperature it continues to stay "liquid") is about 40 degrees LOWER than all of the others... and it's shear point (what temperatures/pressures actually cause it to separate from the two surfaces it is isolating) is so radically HIGHER than any of the others.

The ONLY "bad" thing that can be said about Amsoil's oils... sometimes, you put Amsoil in a motor or transmission, and it starts leaking out!

This means that your seals are bad... if a synthetic leaks out, but a petro does NOT, it means, tolerances on the seals need fixing.

Amsoil recently went from "cult" status (and shady perception) to "mainstream", as many Toyota and Porsche dealers now SELL IT in their parts shop... mine does, down the street (Bob Bridge Toyota, in Renton, near Seattle). It is now a "legitimate" product, because it is endorsed by manufacturers, you know?

Discarding religous zealotry or opinions and bias, and instead relying on factual, scientific testing proves that Amsoil is just plain better than ALL of the others. Redline is good stuff... Bel-Ray and SynthOil and Silkolene are good stuff... but, Amsoil is DEFINITELY the best of the best.

And to answer your question... yes

I have had good experiences with Amsoil in my case. However, when I *first* started running Amsoil in my 3A-C, the rear main seal popped out!

So, I installed a new seal at about 200,000 miles, and now the case holds Amsoil just fine.

- Teddy