Replacing fuel pump... electrical

[SpaceyPuppy]

Hey, long time lurker on these forums, figured that now I'm working on my own 84 Terc, it's time to make an account!

The fuel pump has decided enough is enough, and so that's packed up I suspect, so I'm off to get a replacement fuel pump tomorrow morning, but I do have a few questions.
Around the area I'm in (in Australia) Mechanical fuel pumps are surprisingly few and far between, so I've been recommended an electrical fuel pump.

Basically, I have kinda limited mechanical experience, I'm fine with screwing around and learning and with a few diagrams I'm confident that once I find the wires, I can do that work. Also, I'm mounting the electrical fuel pump in the front and I know I shouldn't but there's no way I can mount it up back in the spot it's resting at the moment, so...

a. How far into the deep end have I jumped trying to make this switch?
b. What can I wire it to re: ignition so it turns on and off at the appropriate time with the ignition?
c. The return feed line won't be used with the new fuel pump so, what do? Just leave it be or what?
d. Is it going to have to be regulated at all and if so what pressure does the mechanical pump run at?
e. Are there any diagrams or photos that I could use to make this easy and... uh... quick, if that's possible that'd be great too!

I don't have access to stuff like a trolley jack or 'basic' items like that so I'm working with the basics here. Is it a hard move to do from mechanical to electrical?

I guess, what I'm really just looking for is a simple to understand walkthrough, or something of the sort.

Thanks very much in advance to you all!

[teranfirbt]

a: Shouldn't be allll that bad, you'll have to fab up a bracket, run wiring, and plumb in some hoses. I'm about to use a Carter replacement pump for a '77 Celica as a booster pump for my 5AFE swap.
b: That would work, but ideally you want the pump to shut off if the engine RPM is zero, this is how fuel injected cars work. This is to make sure that if you have a collision that involves a cut fuel line, you won't feed a fire with more gasoline.
c: You'll want to have a return setup for your fuel pump. Electric fuel pump use the flow of gasoline through them to keep cool, so they need to be constantly flowing.
d: Carbs typically operate at 4-5 PSI.
e: Not that I'm aware of, but I'll be posting up pictures of my 5A swap, I'll try and remember to get some good pictures of the fuel pump setup.

[Petros]

Welcome to the forum.

the simplest thing to do of course is to find a replacement mechanical fuel pump. They are very long lived, reliable and should be easy to remove and replace. I think this same fuel pump was used in the same year corollas, and were used on most of the carburated early Toyotas too. In the states these pumps are not hard to find at all, and cheap.

I suspect you will end spending more going to install an aftermarket electric fuel pump. Not to mention the hazard of having a runaway fuel leak in an accident, or any number of other troubles installing a fuel pump that was not designed for this car. Save yourself the trouble and find the correct fuel pump.

I suggest shopping around some more to see if you can locate the correct mechanical fuel pump, or try ebay or similar.

Of course many professionals and car savvy amateurs convert to electric fuel pumps, but I would not recommend it for a newbie. too much trouble and too many things that can go wrong if not done properly (very dangerously wrong). I think the recommendation you got was from someone who did not know where to look for the correct pump, and although I am sure it was given to you to try and be helpful, but perhaps he was trying to sell you something that he already had in stock. It is not like these fuel pumps (or these cars) are terribly rare and hard to find. If you had a 1961 Voxall or Hillman Minx or a Morris Minor and could not find a fuel pump, than I would understand going to an aftermarket electric fuel pump, not not for a mass produced Toyota.

Since they are durable and reliable fuel pumps, you can even see if you can locate one in a wrecking yard since used ones are a good bet too. I have a number of used spares I will be happy to send you just for the cost of shipping, though I suspect fining one locally would cost less, and going new is always a good idea for parts that are costly to ship. Just do some more searching and phone calls, try a supplier that specializes in Japanese cars.

Good luck.

[ARCHINSTL]

Nit-picking, but ALL Morris Minors had electric fuel pumps from the beginning to the end.
They were always located in the engine bay, but maybe SU pumps were more tolerant of heat than modern pumps.
Tom M.

[SpaceyPuppy]

Thanks for the welcome and to everyone who replied, well as a quick update, I've got the electrical fuel pump installed (finished around 6:30PM! took enough time finding appropriate wiring, about an hour from start to finish), taking into consideration everything that's been said here.

I think that Petros is right on in that it was what was in stock, but he was very helpful about a few other things too, so I'm happy. Am yet to try and actually start the car as I didn't today, it was too late and didn't want to disturb the neighbours!

Ideally I agree in that just having replaced the mech. pump would've been much easier and probably last longer, but the new electric one is in now, so fingers crossed it works!

Also got a trolley jack and support stands now so I'm a bit better equipped to be able to work on it. I've purchased a physical copy of the 1984 Toyota Electrical Wiring Diagrams Booklet for the Tercel, and have the PDF copy of the FSM on literally every device I can have it on.

I know this is an unrelated question but there is no SR5 badging on the vehicle, but the car has a tacho, no inclinometer, but cloth tartan/plaid/patterned seats. I can't work it out. Is it probably a DLX or did Australia maybe have some weird versions of it? :\

[irowiki]

Seats and tach could have been swapped in or been done at the dealer! Auto or manual?

[SpaceyPuppy]

Ah, good point. It's a 5 speed manual, 4WD.

Also, another update, started the car today by placing fuel into the carb itself and it started in under a second then went to a very nice idle, so that's promising, but I can't get the fuel pump to ground any way I try. I've tried mounting the ground wire to various points on the body and nothing works. I've also tried running the ground to the negative terminal on the battery and that didn't work, but I realise that it's kinda silly to do that because with ground wires I know it's always best that the shorter the better for them. So two more questions (so many questions!) What other points can I get to try and ground it properly? and what would affect the grounding of it? Because I held it firmly against the chassis and it didn't run

Also, would it help having a static ground strap coming off the back of the car? Because I have one sitting in front of me here that I am going to put on the car regardless.

Thanks to everyone who's helped out so far, the Tercel has claimed another person right here, I'm loving it so far! Got so many plans for it.

[Gottolovem]

Grounding should not be a difficult task.
Are you positive you have power?
There's a ground strap from firewall to engine try that one.Make sure it's metal to metal(no paint)!
Did you test the pump before you installed it?sometimes you have to tap them with a screwdriver to get them going.
Good luck

[teranfirbt]

Metal to metal on the chassis is all that's really needed for a ground... Paint will cause problems, so grab some sandpaper.
Where are you putting the pump? There are threaded bosses all over the bottom of the car that would make good ground points. One thing I always do when I sand off paint for a ground is to paint back over it to prevent corrosion. If it's under the car, get some undercoating in a can, it's tough stuff.
Like Gottolovem said, are you sure you have 12v power? If you're pulling from a switched 12v wire in the engine bay somewhere you might have an issue with pulling too much current. I would use a relay to power the pump if you aren't already.

[SpaceyPuppy]

I agree in that grounding shouldn't be that difficult. I know there is 12v power going to it definitely, but silly me didn't actually test the pump before I hooked it up, although I am very confident in that it does work. I've decided that instead of me wiring it up directly and making it probably the most unsafe operating electric pump in a Tercel to date, I'm taking it to an auto-electrics shop where it can be done professionally and safety mechanisms can be put in with it such as running it through a relay or from an oil pressure switch, etc. Better safe than sorry, especially with something that deals with such volatile liquids!

Once it's at the point where it will start and run on its own after that, I've got a lot more plans for it and a lot more questions, but I'll start seperate threads for those!

Thanks again for all the responses!