warning: stay away from SOUTHWEST ENGINES

[dlb]

a guy on the 4wd corolla forum is in the middle of having a terrible experience with a used engine seller called southwest engines. here's their website.

http://www.swengines.com/

the guy bought a 4afe along with the 3 yr extended warranty. turns out the engine came with a bad rod knock but unfortunately, the warranty does not take effect until after the 14th day of use and 501st mile. so even though the company sent a bad engine, they are not covering the cost of its installation or removal (the buyer had a shop do it) since the warranty has not taken effect yet. not sure if they are covering shipping each way yet.

selling junk and leaving the customer with the costs to deal with it seems ludicrous to me so i wanted to share it here in case anyone else was considering dealing with swengines. you should be able to read the whole thread on this here.

http://www.alltracwagon.net/forum/m-1391806761/s-0/

[Gottolovem]

What a crock of s**t that's the kind of thing really sets me off

The last motor i bought was from rising sun engine's in chico ca.
I was verry pleased with the sale it was a used motor that the company bench tested before they guarantee it for 6 months. When i got to there shop to pickup the motor there was around a thousand manifolds and a fancy bench testing contraption (Machine) the guy handed me a compression sheet for my engine and a check list of everything he did before he guaranteed it like timing belt,checked head gasket,valves,seals etc.
I left there confident I was getting a good motor it's still running today.

EDIT
I just remember that I got a crate motor with rusty so it was not the last motor i bought

[Petros]

I can understand they would not pay for removal and installation of a bad motor, the seller had nothing to do with that, nor do they have any say so or control over the costs. Interested warranty does not start until 500 miles, if they ship a bad motor they take no responsibility? what if someone installs the motor and runs it without oil? should they replace it than? I think these are there to protect the seller from abuse by the customer, the problem is the buyer has no protection.

It would have been easy enough to drop the pan and check the bearings before it was installed, and replacing the bearings would have only been about $40 (less cost that pulling the engine after you find it was bad). If I was installing a used engine i would drop the pan and insepct the bearings, replace all of the main and cam seals, new timing belt and perhaps a water pump. all these things are cheap and worth it not to have to pull the engine again.

OTOH, he could have (should have) read in detail the warranty and testing (if any) the seller does. You are buying a used engine, no way to know the age or condition unless you take responsibility for it.

this is also why I would rather rebuild an engine rather than buy a "pig in a poke", not knowing how good the engine is, warranty or not, until after pay for it, install it and than get to test drive it. you could luck out, or not. with your own rebuild you know the condition before you run it. I know the temptation, the rebuild costs more than buying an engine. but not if you find out it was junk only after a 20 hour engine swap job, the extra cost of DIY rebuild will seem minor. If I buy a used engine, I know I am taking the risk, and will rebuild it if I have to, or I would not buy it.

IOW, do not whine about the POS engine you just bought, you should have known what you were getting into before you bought it. You need to take precautions to protect yourself if you are not willing to take the risk with used parts.

BTW, this is the reason most repair shops will not installed used engines or used parts, and usually will not even install "new" rebuilt engines or transmissions, too much warranty trouble. It is not worth it for the shop to explain the $1400 engine swap they did ended up with a bad engine, and if the customer wants a running car they will have to pay for it again. There are very few shops that do engine overhauls any more either, only DIY or hot rod shops (who charge big bucks).

[dlb]

i think running a new used engine without oil is a completely different situation from selling a bad engine, and it would be extremely easy to have clear conditions on the warranty to account for those situations. but if the company insists on using such broad policies, they should be transparent about it and say right up front that they cannot guarantee the condition of the engine and are not responsible for any costs associated with installing/removing the engine in the event that it is bad from the start.

buying a used engine that you have never tested from a private seller or a wrecker is a big gamble (one that i personally would not take) but i think that buying one from a company whose entire business is selling them would be quite a bit safer. such a company should be better prepared for these situations by both testing the engines prior to sale and having sensible policies that protect both the buyer and the seller.

having said that, i agree completely that the buyer is ultimately responsible for not reading the fine print carefully enough—and that's exactly why i started this thread: to encourage people to learn the details of what they're getting into so that they might avoid similar unfortunate situations. this thread is not merely an avenue for whining about buying POS used engines.

[Petros]

I went and read the warranty on SW engine's web site, it does not seem unreasonable. they will not warrant it if it was run without fluids, new seals or new timing belt, this is reasonable. The problem is if they shipped a bad engine that was run without oil before they received it, how do you prove that you received it this way? Suppose someone receives a good engine and forgets to put oil in and trashes it, and they try and make a warranty claim? How would SW engines protect themselves from that? This is why I would have pulled the pan and checked the bearings when I replaced the seals and timing belt.

Tell your friend he has to wait 14 days to make his warranty claim, and all he needs to do is tow the car around to get 500 miles on it. Or fill the crank case with STP, Motor honey and Restore, and limp it around very carefully until he reaches 500 miles. Than he can make his warranty claim. I see no such restriction that the car actually has to be running to make a warranty claim. If the warranty only takes effect after those conditions, than all he needs to do it meet them.

Edit: I went and read the thread and than the link to the complaints web page, seems they have a history of selling junk and not honoring the warranty. he should have read that before he bought the engine. He spent almost $1100 for the used engine, that is about what it would have cost to rebuild it (about $500 in parts and machine shop service, and $500-600 in labor), so why buy a used one at that price? And without investigating the company's complaint record? He already was paying the labor to remove and replace the motor, and presumably the other parts, that much more reason to not gamble with a used engine. Even if they did honor their warranty, who needs the hassle and extra time of getting a replacement engine?

One of the reasons I do my own repair work. Also, one of the reasons there are fewer and fewer shops that do heavy maintenance (including engine overhauls); it costs too much to do properly with high risk of warranty claims. It would have been cheaper to buy another used car in good condition than to pay someone to replace the engine.

[Jooseppi Luna]

I feel bad for him. The company sells him a bum motor and then squirrels out of the warranty through an absurd clause. Yes, he should have seen that... but still, it is dishonorable of them.

I wonder if he could drive it 500 highway miles to hit he warranty period. Try to find a moderately hilly region where half of those miles can covered with the engine off :->.

[rer233]

Forget that- pull the cluster and hook up a drill motor- shouldn't take too long to run up 500 miles. Best way to deal with crooks is to "out-crook" them!

[irowiki]

How did they know the miles in the first place?

[Petros]

you report them to the company after the engine is installed to start the warranty period, it is part of the purchase agreement. The problem is, even if he meets the terms of the agreement, it appears getting them to honor their warranty is still difficult based on the number of complaints filed against the company.

[irowiki]

Sounds like it'd be better to report your mileage as 500 below when you install the engine then.