when are shocks bad?

[marlinh]

I was told that the oil is there for cooling. When I replaced my inserts, a friend of mine told me to leave the oil in there. It looks like there is some controversy about that. One thing to check when you install the insert, make sure it actually is held in tight and can't move inside the strut. You will end up with clunk. I had to find some washers that would work when I did my old ones.

[Petros]

The oil in the original strut is what actually dampens the wheel, and it gets hot. It would be cooled by contact with the outer sleeve of the strut. The insert has its own oil, and yes, the oil in the insert gets hot too, it would get cooled with contact with the inner sleeve to the outer sleeve as well.

Oil in the empty space at the bottom would help cool it I suppose since it would conduct heat away faster than air, but the oil also adds weight to the strut. I have never seen any specific instructions on leaving the old oil in the strut tube when replacing the stock shock assembly with an insert. I was always under the impression you dump it all out and allow the insert to do the job. Last time I installed inserts I did leave the inside "wet" with the oil, figuring it would help prevent corrosion and help with the heat transfer from the inner insert wall to the outer tube. but I did not leave all of the oil inside.

[c_j]

this:

Oil in the empty space at the bottom would help cool it...
...leave the inside "wet" with the oil, figuring it would help prevent corrosion and help with the heat transfer from the inner insert wall to the outer tube...

..additionally I would leave enough oil in there so that it is full to the top for most heat transfer and to help dampen any possible movement (when cornering/braking hard) - even though it shouldn't be moving around in there

Also anyone had trouble with the large retainer nut coming loose and the strut cartridge clunking up and down?

I was thinking about drilling one or two small holes in the nut and lockwiring the nut in place next time. I also have a faint memory of stripping the threads on my first T4, but I can't remember if that was from cross-threading or too much torque.

[dlb]

Also anyone had trouble with the large retainer nut coming loose and the strut cartridge clunking up and down?

I was thinking about drilling one or two small holes in the nut and lockwiring the nut in place next time. I also have a faint memory of stripping the threads on my first T4, but I can't remember if that was from cross-threading or too much torque.

i think keith mentioned using loc-tite on the threads. i might try that, although i did not have any problems on a previous terc that a friend replaced the inserts on. i think he just threw them in and did the nut up but i'm not positive.

[ARCHINSTL]

When I did my KYB inserts, I called KYB on this ; they said to leave no oil in the tube.
Tom M.

[marlinh]

Yes, I think I left just enough oil to fill the strut. My friend does front end work for a living so I took his advice. I don't think there is any harm in leaving oil in there. The weight gain is negligible. My insert did move inside the strut after the nut was tightened so I had to hunt down some spacers.

[dlb]

this has turned into quite an ordeal.

the first insert went fine. i left the oil in the housing because the instructions that came with the insert said to. the new inserts came with new retaining nuts, a thick washer, and something like a dust shield that is not mentioned anywhere in the instructions. however, the old nut has a seal that seats on the piston of the insert while the new one does not (the inner diameters are different so i can not swap the seal to the new nut), so i decided to reuse the old nut.



here are the washer (called a 'centering ring' in the instructions) and the dust shield-like mystery part.



it all went together fine and i got the strut mounted back on the car.

with the second insert, i slid it into the housing and the oil in there overflowed quite a bit. i figured there was just more oil in that side for some reason. i got the spring hat and strut mount on, got the spring in place, and started to release the spring. all of a sudden there was a BANG and i noticed that the insert had just extended further, maybe 3 or 4", and that there were some deep marks scored into the piston.







i compressed the spring again, removed the mount and spring hat, and investigated the insert. i can compress it all the way down but when the scores pass into the cylinder, it hangs up really hard. same thing with extending. the gas charge will push it out but only until the scores are almost out of the cylinder and it hangs up there until i pull hard. then it goes past the scores. it seems like the insert was initially stuck where the scores meet the cylinder but as i released the spring and it put pressure on the spring hat and mount, it forced the insert to extend. once fully extended, it's way too tall and the spring barely needs any compression to fit in the strut.

i looked at the part #s on the new insert boxes and they are the same, so i tried to pull the insert out of the tube to check any stamped #s on it but it won't budge. it's stuck in the housing really good. the housing is mounted in a vice and i put the nut on the top of the insert and put some vice grips on that but still, nothing. i had my wife tap the housing lightly with a hammer while i pulled, nothing.

does anyone have any idea what is going on? i'm miffed about the scores, how weirdly tall the insert is, and the fact that it slid into the housing easily but won't come out. i assume the insert is junk but don't know.

[Petros]

that strut is defective. Looks like it has a strut stop welded on there and it failed. You can not drive it that way, it will wipe out the seal in no time every time it passes the seal. It will also allow the strut to over extend, possibly damaging other suspension parts and putting too much angle on the cv axles, it will cause the cv joint to fail.

You need to get it out and get it replaced.

what brand insert was this? they should have a warranty.

[dlb]

these were monroe sensa-tracs or something, part # 72867. it's not a problem to exchange it at the parts store, i just ordered another one.

i got it out by putting the pipe wrench in front of the nut at the top of the insert and tapping the wrench with a hammer. and now i continue waiting for more parts. i guess i'll put the sway bar and shifter back in in the meantime.

[xirdneh]

I had this problem today with same Monroe cartridges 78267
did another topic on it in "General"