Tercel 4wd & Corolla All Trac Wagon: Novice Questions

[SpaceCorp11]

Greetings from Washington State fellow Tercel4wd'ers!

I am in the market for my first car in years and I am trying to choose between a Tercel 4wd & a Corolla All Trac Wagon. I definitely know I want a manual transmission model. I would really appreciate your input on either of these cars. I fully expect that most folks on this forum will be champions of the Tercel 4wd, but I'm sure that there is a great wealth of cumulative knowledge about All Tracs too.

1. Is either car superior in either way?

2. Is there a certain year/make that is preferable to other years/makes?

3. Are parts still easy to acquire if I need to fix up my purchase?

I am saving up and am willing to spend up to 3,000 on either of these cars. I hear nothing but good things about either vehicle.

Thank you in advance for your replies! Looking forward to scoring one of these awesome cars!

[Petros]

welcome to the forum!

You have come to the right place. I have owned and have done heavy maintenance on both vehicles and have a pretty good understanding of both cars, they are both excellent vehicles but their feel and performance is very different. I.e. it is a different type of person that would buy one or the other.

The Tercel4wd is the older model of the two, and accordingly is it more "vintage", its was also based on Toyota's entry level cars so it is also less refined, but more utilitarian. The engine is much easier to repair and do both minor and heavy maintenance and repairs, parts are very available for all the mechanical parts on Tercel4wd, except the transmission. Though very reliable, like the rest of the car, the trans has not had any factory parts made for it since 1987, but there are still plenty of used ones available and there are several after market suppliers of trans parts that stills stock them (but we do not know for how long). The Tercel4wd has better visibility, better ground clearance, and a more responisve and "sporty" handling and shifting compared to the Corolla All-trac, it also weighs less, and appears to have more cargo room. On the down side it has a more primitive 62 hp 8-valve carburated engine, though suitable and reliable, it is not very powerful and there are only a few limited things that can be done to improve the power output to perhaps 75 or 80 hp, and that is about it without a more extensive engine swap. Also, the front brakes are too small and prone to warping if not treated carefully (but this too can be corrected using stock toyota parts with a brake up grade as I outlined over in the repair guild section). Also, drive train is a simple and light true 4x4 with no center diff, it locks out the drive train and should not be driven in 4wd on hard surfaced roads. but on ice and snow and mud, the traction is actually better than with a three differencial AWD type of drive train.

The all-trac is newer, has a more modern, more powerful, and also very reliable and low maintenance 16-valve twin cam fuel injected engine, and there are a lot more performance parts available. The car is also more modern, gives a softer and more quiet ride, but has less ground clearance and is not as responsive since suspension is soft and the car more heavy. Also, rear visibility is not as good as the Tercel4wd, but still better than most modern hatch back/wagon/cross over type vehicles. the All-trac and the Tercel4wd get about the same fuel economy. There were less corolla all-tracs made and show up at wrecking yards far less often, so spare transmissions and other parts unique to this car will be harder to find, but there are also many parts in common with the same years corolla sedan and wagon (like the Tercel). Also, heavy maintenance is more time consuming, pulling engines, trans, or changing struts or front axles, is much more work than on the tercel.

The corolla is a car better suited to comfort and longer drives with its softer suspension, but the tercel is more rugged and utilitarian. After owning both for a number of years (I thought my wife would like the all-trac better, she hates the Tercel mostly because of its age), I decided to keep the tercel and fix the things I did not like about it, and sold the all-trac since my wife decided she did not want to drive it. The Tercel I think is just more fun to drive, lighter and more responsive.

What I do not like about the Tercel is the underpowered carbonated engine, the flimsy front brakes, and the seat comfort, the soft ride and unresponsive steering. So I have undertaken to upgrade the brakes, the handling, the seats, and do an engine swap with a more powerful 16-valve fuel injected engine. The engine swap is by far the most costly and complicated part of my Tercel transformation, most of the other stuff is fairly straight forward removing parts and replacing them with better ones. However, there are some simple engine upgrades that will give better performance without affecting economy, that is much less costly and complicated than doing an engine swap.

Also realize with either car, that these are become very old cars and there will be lots of both minor and major repairs it will need to have done. These cars are so long lived that things that normally never give you any issues start to become troublesome. Not that it will hard to fix, it is just that they keep coming at you. For example, door locks and ignition switches wear out, the heater control cables get sticky and can brake off the levers, the heater control valves and heater cores get corroded and plugged up or leaky, the blower motor gives up, oil pressure or temperature senders go bad, many rubber suspension parts wear out, or rust out. It is not that these are difficult to fix, it is just as it ages these kind of repairs become more common and if you are not handy, and expect to do these things regularly, it will eat you up in lots of repair costs if you always have to take it to a repair shop to have these minor things done. Many can be critical, for example if you do not fix leaky seals or hoses (a $12 part) right away, it could result in major engine damage that is costly and time consuming to repair even if you do it yourself.

With that said, these are great cars I think one of the best little 4x4 wagons ever made. If you can do the minor repairs yourself, either car will serve you well, it is just they are very different kinds of cars. You should go and test drive them and see what they are like. We do have local meets in the Seattle area, it would be good to come to one and drive several of our Tercels, and see if we can find you an all-trac to try.

[dlb]

i love this topic. glad you asked.

1) yes, each car has its strengths and weaknesses. i've owned and loved both. here are just a few of each ones strengths, in my humble opinion of course. i know i'm missing some stuff.

tercel - lots of room in the engine bay to access things. easy to do a timing belt because of the longitudinal engine mount. there are a few easy upgrades (weber carb, reground cam, 4ac engine). the inclinometer is super cool. really fun to drive because it's so weird and unique, like a mountain goat.

corolla - more reliable fuel injection system. more power. smoother ride. quieter ride. more comfortable. vented front brake rotors. easy (relatively speaking) to swap a 4age engine in if you desire ample power.

2) for the tercel, most on the forum seem to prefer the '85-'87 because of the 4.1 diff gearing but i prefer the '83-'84 with its 3.73 gearing. i didn't notice any lack of power on acceleration, at least anymore so than with the later tercs, and the 3.73 cruises at lower rpm which is quieter and gives better fuel economy.

i believe all all tracs have the 4.1 gearing. interesting side note, the 2wd corolla wagons of the same year have the 3.73 gearing.

3) most tercel parts are still easy to get, but many things are not. headlights for the '87s are $75 each from a wrecker and there aren't many of them left. there are lots of little carb pieces that you can only get from a wrecker so it's helpful to have a good wrecker near you to scavenge from on occasion.

i find all tracs are less common in wreckers up here, but i've never needed any parts for mine. like i said in #1, it's a much more reliable fuel delivery system.

overall, i don't really have a preference between the two cars. i've found both are extremely durable and reliable, both are fantastic in snow and mud, both get about 28 mpg city/32 mpg hwy, both look awesome in a weird way, and both are easy to work on. if i were looking for a 4wd wagon, i would buy whichever decent condition tercel or corolla happened across my path. they race is that close to me.

[freespirit]

Great information! I'm a newbe also and am looking at both an '83 Tercel manual and a '89 manual all trac. What are the ground clearences and curb weight of each of the vehicles from '83 to last year they were built?
Also If I was to flat tow behind a small motorhome which ones would be best? Thanks

[Petros]

I would guess the Tercel would be better for towing; it weighs less and is a little smaller. you really need to find good examples of both vehicles and test drive them. they have very different feel to them, and while either will serve you well, you may prefer one over the other. Though it is important you give each a fair comparison, if one or the other has some suspension work that needs to be done, it will not give you a good example of what it would be like to own and drive when it is in good repair.