Brake question

[motownbrowne]

I just did the brakes on the front of my tercel. We did the calipers, rotors, and pads, and the flexible brake lines to the calipers. Now, after bleeding all four of the brakes, it still feels really mushy, like there just isn't any pressure. The calipers close on the rotors, but not with much persuasion it would seem. what should I do?

Thanks

[Petros]

bleed, bleed, bleed. You still have air in it, follow the procedure exactly (see FSM), and keep doing it until the pedal is firm. It is not that easy to get all the air out, i hate doing it, it is messy and troublesome. I may buy a "power bleeder" just so I do not have to do the pedal pump thing so much.

Good luck.

[motownbrowne]

Thank you so much, I guess that PM wasn't necessary. I will update and let you know if I am having any more trouble. By the way, the 195/65/14s look great, way more stable than the stock tires.

[motownbrowne]

On second thought, Petros, I read somewhere about bleeding the master cylinder, which is not covered in the bleeding procedure in the FSM. How do I do that, you mentioned doing before any of the wheels, so I guess I'll head out and try to figure that out.

Thanks again

[ARCHINSTL]

While I did not experience this when I did the T4WD, I did experience it when I did the same (but also including rear brake parts) on my '88 Dodge/Mitsu p'up. I kept bleeding and bleeding and finally realized that the new rear shoes were simply too far away from the drum; I simply had them adjusted too far out. Might check this.
Although, I'd say you probably still have air in the system somewhere. Did you follow the correct bleeding sequence? It is RR, LF, LR, and finally RF.
You may need to bleed the master cylinder as well. See http://www.autozone.com/autozone/repair ... 52800524b9 Or do a Search here - do not recall if covered in the Club archives.
Tom M.

[Petros]

to bleed the master, you should always do that first, you have someone pump it up and hold the pedal, and than loosen the 10 mm flare hose nut on the brake line until fluid leaks out. Do one line at a time. I put a large rag under it to catch the brake fluid, and than clean it off well with carb cleaner and soap and water (brake fluid is corrosive). You can see and hear any trapped air leak out, it will bleed clear fluid when the air is out of the master.

If you do not bleed the master first when you install a new one, you have to pump the air bubbles from the master all the way to rear brakes. If you did not remove or break the lines at the master you should not have to bleed it unless you allowed the fluid level to get too low and you pumped air into it.

[motownbrowne]

Well, we bled the lines some more. We did bleed the master cylinder, but only one of the 10mm nuts would loosen, so I guess we did it half way. All of the wheels bled well with the exception of the rear driver's side, which sort of dripped persistently during the bleeding procedure. When we started bleeding that brake, the fluid was pretty foul, but after several minutes, the drips turned clear. It would seem that something is clogged in the rear line. When we were testing the brakes with the engine on, the pedal seemed more responsive than before the initial bleeding. When the engine was off, it seemed to hold pressure on the pedal fine, but once the engine was started, the pedal lost power, and it seems like I was able to pump the pedal and gain some pressure, but then it would sink after that. It didn't sink slowly, rather pretty fast. I am not sure what to do, it is now raining and dark out. I think my only option at this point is to drive or tow it to the mechanic in the morning, unless anyone has any brilliant ideas. At this point I've spent well over 800 bucks on the wheels, tires, brakes, etc. in the last three days, what's a couple hundred more? I was going to ask the mechanic to try bleeding it with their bleeding system to see if that fixes it, otherwise I suppose I may have to do the master cylinder. The funny thing about this is that I have a craigslist rider for this trip who is probably growing impatient as the days pass.

[keith]

Some pads are just softer than others, and it shows up most when the pads are new and thickest. I suggest that you take the car out on the road and, after bedding the brake pads, do a panic stop and see if the brakes work.

See your brake pad installation paper for the bedding technique, it varies with manufacturers.

[takza]

You need to BENCH bled the master cylinder...but if it's already on the car...you can get some air out sometimes by bleeding at the fittings where the fluid leaves the MC. When I did mine...I ended up using a hand vac pump to finally get them bled right.

How close the rear shoes are to the drums makes a big diff as to how far the pedal goes down...they will take a good while to seat. You need to use the e-brake when you park it so they self adjust...if something is wrong with the self-adjuster...you need to adjust them manually.

[rer233]

i agree with taksa- bench bleed a replacement master cyl (tried to post this the other night, but something screwed up and it didn't get thru.) with an old cyl, i don't like to pedal- bleed the wheels- sometimes when the m cyl piston goes past it's normal range of travel, gunk inside it can get dislodged and cause a whole new set of problems. i prefer pressure- bleeding. PETROS- i've found that the poor- man's alternative to a real pressure- bleeder is to fill the m cyl reservoir, open the bleeder on the desired wheel, and GENTLY apply compressed air to the vent hole in the reservoir cap with an air blower while holding firm downward pressure on the cap. i also run a clear plastic hose from the bleeder to a catch bottle (also clear.) that way i know how much fluid i've run thru the bleeder. only trick is- you have to monitor the fluid level in the reservoir and top- up as required. added benefits of this method are- no mess on the garage floor and you don't need a helper! (cruical for my situation.)

[xirdneh]

I do not remember if there is a RH and LH caliper on these cars
or if its possible to install them wrong
but something to keep in mind
my friend mixed 'em up on his truck and they could not be bled