Sound

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:03 am

Just got my new deck in today. Pioneer 4600MP. It sounds tight with my speakers, compared to the ghetto little tape deck that was in there. It really complements the Infinity Reference 512i speakers I have in the back. Still have to steal the front ones out of the dead Terc. The current front ones are the stock 86 speakers. God knows how they've survived this long. Have fade on so much to the rear that the fronts are barely operating. Don't want to kill the fragile things.
As soon as I get the money, 2 10" subs are going in- CompVR Kickers. Competition level 300 watt RMS each subs. Still dunno what amp I'll use, and dunno if I'll get a cap. Also dunno what I'm going to steal the alternator from lol. I'll need more than 55 amps. Was thinking about one out of a 96 Passat - 16 volt 120 amp alternator. Just dunno about fitting on the different style pulley and dunno if the engine could survive idling with that kind of a pull on it.
Any thoughts?

3A-C Power · Post by **3A-C Power** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:41 pm

Using 16 volts might break things that were made for 12. Maybe the volkswagen has a regulator that lets it handle the 16 volts. The Tercel has some alternators with an external regulator and some built into the alternator. If your alternator had a built in regulator and you replace it with something that doesn't, things will probably break.

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:11 pm

Well, I know I'd need a regulator that would convert it into good ole' 12 volt power, meaning it'd charge quickly and would have no issue keeping up with the power demand. But have to concentrate on other things, like the carburator first.

sacwac · Post by **sacwac** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:14 pm

A very long time ago, I had a nice stereo in my old tercel (now a small cube).

If I recall, it had a Pioneer deh-p600, an Alpine mrd-752, 1 10" sub, 2 8" rears, 2 4" fronts.

The amp was installed under the rear seat, and the 8" speakers were mounted to holes I cut in the backrest of the back seat (holes went through the seat). I made my own 1cu ft box for the sub, made sure to hide everything as best as possible. It had more stereo power than I cared for.

These old tercels are not high power stereo friendly... to many rattles, speakers in the front are way too small.

Now, I'm happy with just the regular old stock radio, and radio shack speakers $5.

Typrus, just my 2 cents:
I would only install 1 of those subwoofers. One 12" or one 10". Your box will be smaller, cost will be less, it will probably sound better as there will be more room in the trunk for the subs. One sub installed properly should be louder than anyone should listen to.
Unless your lights dim as the subs hit the low notes, you don't need the cap. It won't make your sound any better. I didn't need one.
I doubt you will need more than 55 amps. Seriously, thats about 760watts @ 13.8V. Ever put just 1W into a speaker? I have, you'd be suprised how little power it takes to drive speakers really loud. It probably wont even take half that power to make you want to turn the volume down.
Also, save some cash, and don't buy the super thick cable (power and speaker). Think about it, why run 12GA speaker wire to the subs if inside the sub there is 50ft of 22GA magnet wire?
I'd say, run it off of the tercels alternator first, no harm there.

I built a 35W tube amp for home use, and it drives my speakers to ear splitting volumes.

Anyways, it depends on your goal, some people like their stereos SUPER loud. Shrug.

Have fun with it!

I agree with 3A-C Power, using a 16Vdc system is probably a really bad idea.

icE · Post by **icE** » Tue Dec 07, 2004 3:13 pm

^^ very informative post

i currently have 3 10inch jensen subwoofers, all in a sealed box. It sounds pretty decent. It doesn't hit the extremely low notes because they're 10 inches and it's a sealed box, but it hits the notes very well, no sloppy sounds, very accurate. I bought it from someone on a local classifieds website, it was $200 for the 3 subs, the box, the amp, and a pioneer cd deck, so you can't get much of a better deal than that!

However, on my next car, i'd probably get a sealed box with 1 12"inch speaker in there. Everyone I know has 2, so having 1 would be a lil different, and it'd probably be loud enough. Have you seen the crutchfield catalog or been to crutchfield.com? I would never buy anything there, too overpriced because of their tech support, installation help, etc, but it gives the RMS of the amps and the speakers. This is good if you're looking around before u buy ur system, because that peak wattage rating means nothing and is no where close to the RMS usually.

Anywho, how much does cubic footage matter in a sealed box? I've always liked the idea of sealed boxes, but how small can you have a box and it still sound decent and have enough space? Also, has anyone had experience with Dynamat or Hushmat sound deadening material?

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Tue Dec 07, 2004 3:53 pm

The subs are not costing me anything. I got the subs and an enclosure for free for my birthday. My rear speakers are something like 22watt. Front will be 22-24watt. The two subs are 600watts RMS between them. 22x4 is 88 right? 688 watts if I'm really going at it. 759 watt output from the alternator. twox 55watt headlights= 110. Add to stereo RMS, 798watts. Not enough to run even the headlights assuming I really crank it.
If I can stand in front of speakers at concerts for 3k people with concert volume on and only 24 people in the room and not explode (the back of just one of those speakers said 2500 watts, 5 of them in a bank) then I think I can handle full vol in my car from time to time, though normally around 1/4-1/2 is great.
What would I do assuming I wanted to play my music at a basketball court and was only able to have the engine at idle, where it can't put out optimal power?
These are a few reasons why I want a more powerfull alternator. Does anyone know of even a 100 amp 12 volter I could toss on there with not a lot of hassle beyond swapping pulleys?
Before I even think of that, I'll have to rebuild/place my carburator. Dang thing is on its last.. jets? 186k miles will do a lot to a carb.

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Tue Dec 07, 2004 5:23 pm

sacwac wrote:Also, save some cash, and don't buy the super thick cable (power and speaker). Think about it, why run 12GA speaker wire to the subs if inside the sub there is 50ft of 22GA magnet wire?

Well that bit on wiring isn't COMPLETELY accurate...if there is alot of current flowing through the wires going to the speakers, (which presumably there will be, for subs especially) then smaller wires (with their corresponding higher resistance) will have more voltage drop than larger wires...and voltage drop BEFORE the sub is a bad thing...but voltage drop INSIDE the subs magnet windings is a very good thing.

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Tue Dec 07, 2004 6:57 pm

Heh. Yup. I guess heres one way to think of it. You use 120 volt in your house right? Well why not drop the big lines from 100+k volts to 120? Not as strong of a signal, nowhere near as much capacity for power, not to mention the transformers dropping that 120 volt down to maybe .12 volts. High volts, low amps gets "transformed" into low volts, higher amps.

sacwac · Post by **sacwac** » Tue Dec 07, 2004 9:52 pm

ice:
I have never been to crutchfield.com, and yes, as with most car audio stuff, it's way overpriced. I also do not put much faith into those peak power values. You even have to be careful with the RMS values sometimes. Cubic footage does matter, usually the subwoofer manufacturer will publish some suggestions for boxes. If you custom build your own box, and build it such that it matches the angle of the backseat, a 1ft^3 box doesn't take up that much space. I've heard a few cars with dynamat installed (I heard before and after). I could never tell any difference. To me, it's just heavy.

typrus:
You can't beat free!! If you want to try a high output alternator, try looking on some aftermarket off-road toyota truck sites. I bet those older toyota trucks use the exact same alternator, and that someone makes high output versions. Here:
<a href='http://www.northwestoffroad.com/parts/alternators.html' target='_blank'>http://www.northwestoffroad.com/parts/a ... rs.html</a>

adelard of bath:
Correct, but I doubt you will ever hear the difference.

Anyways, it's real easy to get totally carried away with all the hype surrounding car audio. Your ear is the final listening test, and it's fairly subjective.

icE · Post by **icE** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 7:33 am

true

But in my civic the trunk rattles real bad from the outside everytime the subs hit hard. Do you think that dynamat material would help? I'll have to try it sometime and give you guys the results.

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:03 am

Dynamat should help in that situation if applied correctly.

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 10:49 pm

I'm not much of an audio person but I used some old extension cord wire that had the plugs cut off and I soldered them together and sealed them with electric tape. They were hooked up to a very good amp that cost my teacher $20. Actually it's the teacher's system in his room and when you bump it, you can really hear it.

He knows a lot more than I do. Makes me realize what a crap job they did when they took out and put it that Kenwood deck that they recently stole from me. Dang thing sounded like crap and it just a mess. Going to do the wiring again.

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Thu Dec 09, 2004 2:35 pm

The right wiring is very important for a clear, crisp sounding system

Darren · Post by **Darren** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:33 pm

Typrus,

You seem to be totally misinformed, and stuck in the audiophile paranoia la la land.
The right wiring is NOT important for a clear, crisp sounding system, whatever clear and crisp means. Those are magical words that the crazies use. Speaker and amplifier are important. You could use 32GA wire-wrap wire and still get the same quality sound. It will be quieter, because at high power levels, wire that thin will act like a good resistor. But, you will not use any sound quality.

Please, get a clue.

Thereminator · Post by **Thereminator** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:40 pm

Hey Darren,everyone has a right to make mistakes

,afterall,our nature is a work-in-progress <_< .This site is known for its respectfull tolerence and indivdual collabortion,and for that...We can thank our Members and the Monitors