Yet another problem THIS TIME WITH VIDEO! :)

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:33 am

My turkle must be one of the most problematic as of late.. I hate posting here all the time - I always try first.. i really do!

Ok so I replaced my alternator with a rebuilt one recently because my old one was very obviously on its way out. The charge light was on always up until a certain rpm when I guess it would spit out just enough juice in order to turn the light off... the rpm required to turn the light off kept going up and up until it was just always on and I could tell that each time I started the car it had a bit less juice turning the starter. So before it wouldnt start at all i replaced the alt.

This was about 2-3 weeks ago. I noticed that the serpentine belt was cracking when I replaced the alt. so I just made a mental note that it needed to get done soon also.

Well the other day I got in my car and smelt burning rubber after a minute or so of the car warming up - I didnt think too much of it, I wasnt sure what it was and I'm still not sure what it was but when I got to my destination that day I noticed the charge light as on again. So, I put the two together and figured it was my serpentine belt slipping causing my new alternator to spin, but not fast enough.

So that brings us to about an hour ago when I replaced my serpentine belt, but it didn't fix the issue.

I did a quick once over of all of the connections in that area around the alternator and everything is very clean and solid, but thats not to say that this problem could be attributed to a bad ground somewhere else.

Anyhow, I made a quick little video to demonstrate how the problem is now. I narrated it for your viewing pleasure (I hate hearing my own voice).

Oh, i forgot to mention that I also have a brand new battery as of a couple of weeks ago just in case that is relevant

Also just something to note, for whatever reason in my experience over the past few weeks the Brake Light and Charge light on the dash always come on at the same time with these issues. If I pull up the hand brake only the brake light comes on of course, but when it's something charge related both of them always come on. I'm not sure if this is normal or not... you'll see what I mean in the video.

Here's the video:
http:/jammin.jshost.ca/tercelproblem/tercelbroken.wmv

**It wont let me make a proper link right some reason. I tried and and <a href="blah"></a>.. neither seem to be working so you'll need to copy and paste.

Post by **ARCHINSTL** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:31 pm

http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/t61422.html
viewtopic.php?t=536&highlight=brake+light
viewtopic.php?t=697&highlight=brake+light
Takza has some good Google searches in the previous two topics.
Also following quotes from arbskynxex and iCe, respectively:
I agree with Typrus, get your alternator checked. I've had the brake light come on and stay on twice and each time it was the alternator that was bad. If you look at the FSM wiring diagram you'll see that the charge indicator and the brake light meet and then ground out. There is a diode in the brake indicator line to keep power from flowing the wrong direction, it's probably blown, therby lighting the brake light.

I was driving last night and the temp, battery, and brake light all came on, n stayed on. My dad had this problem before, it needs a new alternator. We'll probably get another one sometime this week. The remanufactured alternators aren't that great, the original stock alternator lasted 13 years! I think later, when i get some more money, i'll put in a higher performing alternator for my high-power sound system
You did not mention it, but is your brake light staying on? Let us know and hope this helps.
Tom M.

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 1:21 pm

Hi Tom,
I think you may have misunderstood what I meant about the brake light. This really has nothing to do with anything

I was just merely clarifying why in the video that I posted the brake light was on.

The problem is that the charge/battery light is on and my alt is making very little voltage.

if you watch the vid you'll see what i mean about the brake light, it just comes on whenever the charge light comes on.

//edit// i just read the threads you posted. these are all describing my situation BEFORE I replaced the alternator (I have a later model than most of them discussed in those threads so my regulator is internal). the problem im having now is sort of the opposite as far as when the lights go on. now they come on at higher rpm instead of lower rpm - and off at low rpm instead of high rpm. im confused :-/

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:01 pm

jammin1911 wrote: the problem im having now is sort of the opposite as far as when the lights go on. now they come on at higher rpm instead of lower rpm - and off at low rpm instead of high rpm. im confused :-/

ok so, i just did a run to the bank and i had to use my windshield sprayer and wipers due to salt for the first time in a few days.

I think I found the problem. The sprayer sprayed so hard it mostly went right over the top of my windshield and the wipers went so darn fast that the low speed was quite a lot faster than the high speed normally is.

so I think I now have TOO MUCH voltage, would which explain why i'm having the opposite problem that i had a few weeks ago when my alt. was dying.

i'm going to measure the voltage at the battery as soon as I can find my voltmeter.

I'm a mechanical newbie so this could be complete sillyness and way off but according to my inexperienced and usually-wrong logic -- this is what makes most sense!

I'll report my findings.

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:40 pm

So, voltages are as follows at the battery terminals:

Off: ~14.5V
Idle: ~14.5V
Driving/Revving: ~16V

Is this likely the cause of my issues? Is the light going on because there is TOO MUCH voltage?

Mickey_D · Post by **Mickey_D** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 3:23 pm

Yes, the light will come on due to too much voltage. And you're going to cook your battery rather quickly as well as quite a few other electrical components. Particularly lights and stereo.

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 4:32 pm

OK So just to clarify, this would be a result of a bad voltage regulator - correct?

Also, my car being a 1986 SR5 4WD Wagon, the alternator has an internet voltage regulator?

If this is the case I'll need to take this alternator back ASAP, I need to go to work on Monday like this - it doesn't look like I'll have much choice.

I'll use as little electrical as i can.
i dont care if the lights go, not a big deal to replace those I guess.

i'll not use the wipers and i'll try not to use the sprayers. i dont have a stereo in there.

is there anything else i need to worry about in the meantime?

So yeah, voltage regular is the issue? and its in the alternator??

Mickey_D · Post by **Mickey_D** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 9:12 am

Actually, motors will be the least affected by an over-voltage situation. They will also be a pretty heavy draw on the system, helping bring the voltage down.

If you absolutely HAVE to drive with it like this, keep your revs as low as possible.

The better thing to do at this point is to disconnect the plastic plug at the back of the alternator and drive only on the battery until you can fix it. A 16 volt over-voltage condition is going to cause SO many problems. Everything from your electric choke to your coil are going to be getting cooked by this. And getting a ticket for blown brake lights (or worse a rear-end accident) is certainly not going to make your day. And I can speak from experience that you REALLY don't want to cook your battery too long like that. I had one explode under the hood of my Jeep because of the exact same problem. It cost me a little over $200 in 1991, and I only had 5 wires and two vacuum lines under my hood . It's a little more complicated (and expensive) on our little Tercs.

If you don't have too far to drive (under 20 miles or so each way) I would disconnect the plastic wiring harness on the back of the alternator and drive on the battery. Especially beneficial if you have a wall plug in at work and you can take your battery charger to maintain the battery for the drive home.

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 9:39 am

Thanks for the tips mickey, I'm definitely going to be careful now that I understand what's going on.

This is a result of a bad voltage regulator, right? Is the voltage regulator in the alternator?

Thanks,

John

Mickey_D · Post by **Mickey_D** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 11:40 am

I'm not entirely sure if our cars use an internal or external. Generally an easy way to tell is if the plastic connector on the back has 3 or 4 wires, it's internal, and if there's only 1 or 2 wires, it's external. But not always.

My '86 is internal. But it doesn't have A/C, so yours may be different. They like to do things like that. The California model will be different than the Federal, which will be different again from the Canadian. And since all 3 models were sold everywhere, it's really hard to tell.

And since it's Sunday, I can't call my local parts handyman and ask. Sorry.

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 1:15 pm

No problem a all, I appreciate the input.

I have an 86 with no AC and the connector has at least 3 pins, possibly 4. - i cant remember for sure.

i was pretty sure that the guy i ordered the alt. from said it was an internal regulator so i just wanted to clarify. is it safe to say that the regulator is the cause of this problem?

Mickey_D · Post by **Mickey_D** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:54 pm

Either that or the wiring to the little plastic plug is corroded.

Saying that, when I had my little Chevy LUV 4X4, I went through 7 alternators in a row from Schuck's before I got one that actually kept working for longer than it took me to drive home. So getting one bad from the store is not above reality.....

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 11:22 am

Crazy haha

Well I just put in a "new" rebuilt alt and the problem went away.

I just want to be clear here, because I dont want this to happen again.

There are 2 connections on the alternator, right? There is the "big" round plug and then there is the one on the top which is some sort of electrical connection that bolts on with a 10mm bolt.

is that is? what is the "little plastic connector" that you mentioned? I didnt hook up any little plastic connector i dont think hehehe

Mickey_D · Post by **Mickey_D** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 11:38 am

I hadn't actually looked at the back of one of our alternators until just now.

You are correct, there's the main charging wire and the three wire connector for the regulator. That round black connector on the left is normally a square or rectangular white plastic version.

jammin1911 · Post by **jammin1911** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:24 pm

excellent thanks mickey!

thats not quite what mine looks like, but very similar.

the power wire is on the top of mine.

anyhow, good stuff thanks a lot!

i just have to cross my fingers now that the damn regulator doesnt blow again, i might have a hard time convincing the store i got it from that its the alternators fault, not mine.

i hope its not my car causing the issue..