Transmission problems - pops out of overdrive

[Jerry]

Hello everyone,

Been a while since I've been on - hope everyone's doing well.

I'll cut to the chase. My '84 with 251,500 miles on it had a junkyard tranny installed by the previous owner. (Probably around 20,000 miles ago or so.)

I'm crusing down the freeway on Friday, 5th gear, going about 65 - 70, when all of a sudden the car jumps out of 5th. It did that a couple of times previously, but now when I shift back into 5th it pops right out.

Now, I'm not a tranmssion expert, but I think that's a sign of that gear being worn out. My concern is that I really don't have any $$ to put into the car right now, and want to know how long I can get by drivig this thing using 4th as the high gear?

The other worrying thing - in neutral with the clutch engaged, I hear a popping / clicking sound intermittently. Ugh!

The car is beat to heck - was that way when I bought it - but really does run pretty good. So, I guess I'd also appreciate if anybody around me has a decent used 5 speed for sale and wouldn't mind helping me swap it out...

Thank you in advance for your diagonsis / help - take care.

Jerry Trickey
Bakersfield, CA

[Typrus]

I dunno what to tell you as to why it does it. Never heard of a Terc doing it, but I know early MR2's loved to do it at higher mileages.

It isn't going to hurt to drive in 4th. You'll lose fuel economy benefits and if you run too quick might hurt your engine from increased RPM's for long periods. Other than that, I dunno what could be harmed.

Though one thought it that if something sheared off your 5th gear, you might want to have that fluid power-flushed out... Quick. Because you might have a few hunks of metal begging to screw more up.

[Jerry]

Good point about flushing out the fluid. At the very least, I'll try to do a quick drain / replace over the weekend.

Yeah, when driving in 4th I'm trying to keep the RPM's under 3000 or so - the way my luck has been going, I don't want to throw a rod!

Jerry

[Typrus]

Its pretty much impossible to throw a rod on our cars unless they get oil starved, be it from no oil in the pan or from pump failure. Never heard of a A series throwing a rod as long as it has oil. Make sure your engine has good oil in it... No WalMart cheap-ass special.

[Jerry]

I run Castrol, so no cheap oil here... Nor am I going to spin it to 8000 RPM or otherwise do something that would endanger it...

[Gasoline Fumes]

No WalMart cheap-ass special.

Last I heard, Walmart's SuperTech oil was made by Mobil. Whether or not it's the same quality as the Mobil-branded stuff I don't know. I'm cheap, I use it.

[kamiphloj]

I have never fixed a trans and I don't know what I am talking about.
My imagination tells me when the drive and driven shafts are parallel things work well.If a bearing on one shaft develops excessive clearance,the two shafts are not parallel and so the gear will want to drift.Like the tracking adj on a belt sander.
The trans is a ZF I believe.Has anyone tracked down an overhaul manual and or a source of rebuild kits? There is a trans shop I may ask about parts.It seems like transmissions are the key to when the terc becomes extinct.My parts car trans pops out of second.What is there to lose trying to fix them.
About revs and rods,I bounce off 5000 once in a while,15 years of tercs never heard of losing a bottom end.
Per Smoky.biggest source of rod failure is detonation.It causes the bearing shells to close on the journals,wiping the crank dry.Don't ping your motor.

[Jerry]

I've thought about putting another transmission in the car, but don't have the resources to do so (either time, money, or a engine lift to get everything out of the car!).

I think my plan is to nurse it along to the end of the year. The car has a number of rust problem areas, including the roof, rear quarter panels and windshield support, so it's really not worth putting a bunch of money into. Anyway, the end of the year will coincide with when it's due to be smogged again, which I am pretty sure it will fail - the county I live in has the strictest smog check regulations in the nation.

With that being the case, I will be eligible to retire it by sell it back to the state for $1000.00 - much more than I could get selling through a private party. At that time though, I'd like to help as many of my Tercel bretheren out as possible.

In order to qualify for the state's trade in program, the car has to be drivable, and pass a few other criteria - see http://tinyurl.com/lyjzx I do think it would be a shame for the state to get some of the upgraded parts I have put on it, notably the heavy duty radiator and the new tires / "premium" mag wheels (the ones that look like squares) that I have on it. If anybody is interested, I will be selling these parts for very reasonable prices, but part of the deal will be that you will have to replace them with your existing parts so I can at least get it to the recycling station. Will keep you guys posted, but if you're in or around the Bakersfield, CA area keep this in mind.

Jerry

[Mickey_D]

Long before you think about replacing the tranny, remember our engines sit longitudally so they develop problems and symptoms just like a RWD car.

An old trick to tranny's poppoing out of high gear was to check your engine and tranny mounts. A worn or failed engine moount wil push the tranny out of alignment with the shifter causing it to want to pop back to center.

Do yourself a favor and either check or replace (they ain't that expensive) all three mounts - two engine and one tranny.

[Typrus]

Not expensive? I think its maybe $80 a mount last I checked! Of course, compared to a tranny thats not too horribly much I suppose.

[ARCHINSTL]

Mickey_D's suggestion re the drivetrain moving relative to the lever is true - though whether or not on our cars, I do not know.
I bought the two motor mounts and the transmission mount for $160, with free freight, from Butler Toy in Indy last January. A similar, non-OE, trio from Autozone, et al, seems to be around $150+ online.
I am waiting for the two steering rack bushings from the same source - made sense to do them as well, as long as there was "room" to work.
I hope this eliminates some clunking on deceleration and smoother takeoffs from a standstill - all were dramatically smaller than new, and the left was as soft as the proverbial baby's bottom from oil...pix to come on another thread.
Tom M.

[takza]

One solution I've seen is to just use a light bungee cord to hold the lever in gear. I'd change the oil.

[Jerry]

Thanks, all, for your input and advice.

Other symptoms that make me think it's the transmission and not something else (though I'm open to ideas from the more knowledgable people out there):

1. After a little experimentation, I can actually engage 5th gear at highway speeds. As long as I stay on the gas, it'll stay in gear. When I let off, it will pop out.

2. When doing #1, the gearshift lever falls back into the "neutral" position. I can move move back and forth without any problem.

3. If I let off the gas and try to put it back into third (push clutch in first, of course), it grinds.

4. Now this issue is where I think maybe the whole transmission mount issue might have some merit... There have been a couple of times where I've shifted to neutral in anticpation of stopping for a light, but the transmission stays stuck in gear. Likewise, I've had problems backing up in reverse to maneuver into a prking spot, then been unable to put the car in first to pull forward.

Thank you again, everyone...

Jerry

[Mickey_D]

Not expensive? I think its maybe $80 a mount last I checked! Of course, compared to a tranny thats not too horribly much I suppose.

$97 for both sides.

And $54.49 from Never A Part Available, and in my experience they are always the most expensive.

So ARCHINSTL looks like he got them for NAPA's price with free shipping.

[takza]

Have you ever taken the console out and got a look under the boots? Maybe loose bolts...needs oil under the boots?