Please please help.. !
I am pretty new at repairing cars. I've done some basics, struts, breaks, things an amateur can diagnose! I bought this car about 8 months ago, and I can't really tell how it was treated. It's not nearly as pristine as my 1980 Toyota Long Bed truck, but like all toyota's, it seems study! I can't seem to figure out this new (now month or two old) problem. When I am going up hills, which are pretty big out here in New Mexico, the cars bucks pretty hard. It happens in 4th and 5th gear, not constantly, but it does happen almost every time up any hill, slight incline, or large incline (bucking corresponds: bigger the hill, more the bucking).
Changed fuel filter, Changed fuel pump (big was of sixty bucks, bummer when it didn't work..), tried to find any disconnected hoses and I can't. The hoses all look pretty good too, but there are so many! Took it to a mechanic. He said he fixed it by fixing the timing, and the distributor cap was off, he said, and he put it back on, TO NO AVAIL, 80 bucks down the drain, and the problem has seemed to be getting worse. More frequent bucking.
I'm going to put new spark plugs in today, just to check and maintain. I'm going to re-check the hoses, too. All's I got is common sense for this one right now. Is there a technical way of going about this?
Is it the vacuum seal? If so, what are the necessary steps to getting to the source of the problem.
Oh yeah, one more thing: The car came with the 1984-19?? repair manual. Should I buy the 1983 manual or should I just stick with this one?
I hope I'm not incapable of finding the problem. Out here in New Mexico every mechanic has told me: It's old, it'll do that. ! This is frustrating, because I know that something is wrong. And it's not old, as I am the same year as my tercel!
Thank you thank you thank you, I hope someone can help
1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtns!
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- My tercel:: 1983,4wd, No mods yet
1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtns!
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- dlb
- Highest Ranking Member
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- My tercel:: '87 sr5, '83 dlx parts car
- Location: bc, canada
Re: 1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtn
welcome, ilovetrash. yet another great username. i do too, if by trash you mean wicked old beaters that are better than any new cars. i like the graphics on your car. did you do them?
https://tercel4wd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8103
it will be fine. there were very few changes to 4wd tercels over their production run and most of the changes were only cosmetic.
on to your issue. it's likely something very simple and easy to repair. tracking it down is the hard part but even that is not so hard. first, i would check the air filter since you didn't mention that. next, i would check the carb float level. to do this, park on level ground, remove the air filter housing, and look through the sight glass on the front of the carb. rock the car a little bit if you can't tell where the fuel level is. the fuel level should be between the two points on the window. if it's really low, you could have the symptoms you describe but i suspect you would also experience slight bucking on cornering as well. if the fuel level is fine, i would continue checking for vacuum leaks. you mentioned that all the vacuum hoses are connected, but you need to verify that they are hooked up correctly and that all the things they are connected to are not leaking. to do this, look on the underside of your hood. there should be a sticker with the vacuum diagram. if not, you need to confirm which emissions set up you have and use the appropriate vacuum diagram found in the FSM. if your car is originally from new mexico, it's probably the federal model, in which case you can use this colour-coded diagram.
https://tercel4wd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2810
once you have confirmed all the vacuum lines are routed correctly, you can then begin testing the various vacuum components. test the PCV using the test in the FSM. for all the various diaphragms (TP, choke opener, choke breaker, and vacuum advance), put a clean hose on each one and suck. if you can suck air through, the diaphragm is broken and needs to be disconnected and plugged until you can replace it. otherwise they act as vacuum leaks because the engine is able to suck air through them.
i would also check your EGR. over time, carbon buildup stops the EGR valve from completely sealing and you wind up with a vacuum leak of exhaust straight into the intake manifold. completely disable the EGR is a small project though so i would test only after testing the other easier things. to disable the EGR, you must disconnect and plug the vacuum lines that go to it, then undo the big nut and bolt that fasten the exhaust tube to the EGR (be careful not to strip them!), get a new 20x1.50mm bolt to plug the exhaust manifold, and one to plug the EGR itself. most people wind up removing the EGR altogether for another mod but i just realized that you can leave it in place if you simply plug the hole in it with a big bolt, like on the exhaust manifold end of the tube.
try those things and let us know how it goes.
what vacuum seal are you talking about? there are many sources of vacuum and many seals so you need to be specific.Ilovetrash wrote:Is it the vacuum seal? If so, what are the necessary steps to getting to the source of the problem.
if it's a factory service manual, like the one available hereIlovetrash wrote:Oh yeah, one more thing: The car came with the 1984-19?? repair manual. Should I buy the 1983 manual or should I just stick with this one?
https://tercel4wd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8103
it will be fine. there were very few changes to 4wd tercels over their production run and most of the changes were only cosmetic.
do not listen to those mechanics. 'old' is not synonymous with 'malfunctioning,' and you don't want anyone who has that kind of "good enough" attitude working on your car anyway. who knows what else will be "good enough" for them? i find it best to work on my own stuff since i care about it more than anyone else will.Ilovetrash wrote:I hope I'm not incapable of finding the problem. Out here in New Mexico every mechanic has told me: It's old, it'll do that. ! This is frustrating, because I know that something is wrong
on to your issue. it's likely something very simple and easy to repair. tracking it down is the hard part but even that is not so hard. first, i would check the air filter since you didn't mention that. next, i would check the carb float level. to do this, park on level ground, remove the air filter housing, and look through the sight glass on the front of the carb. rock the car a little bit if you can't tell where the fuel level is. the fuel level should be between the two points on the window. if it's really low, you could have the symptoms you describe but i suspect you would also experience slight bucking on cornering as well. if the fuel level is fine, i would continue checking for vacuum leaks. you mentioned that all the vacuum hoses are connected, but you need to verify that they are hooked up correctly and that all the things they are connected to are not leaking. to do this, look on the underside of your hood. there should be a sticker with the vacuum diagram. if not, you need to confirm which emissions set up you have and use the appropriate vacuum diagram found in the FSM. if your car is originally from new mexico, it's probably the federal model, in which case you can use this colour-coded diagram.
https://tercel4wd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2810
once you have confirmed all the vacuum lines are routed correctly, you can then begin testing the various vacuum components. test the PCV using the test in the FSM. for all the various diaphragms (TP, choke opener, choke breaker, and vacuum advance), put a clean hose on each one and suck. if you can suck air through, the diaphragm is broken and needs to be disconnected and plugged until you can replace it. otherwise they act as vacuum leaks because the engine is able to suck air through them.
i would also check your EGR. over time, carbon buildup stops the EGR valve from completely sealing and you wind up with a vacuum leak of exhaust straight into the intake manifold. completely disable the EGR is a small project though so i would test only after testing the other easier things. to disable the EGR, you must disconnect and plug the vacuum lines that go to it, then undo the big nut and bolt that fasten the exhaust tube to the EGR (be careful not to strip them!), get a new 20x1.50mm bolt to plug the exhaust manifold, and one to plug the EGR itself. most people wind up removing the EGR altogether for another mod but i just realized that you can leave it in place if you simply plug the hole in it with a big bolt, like on the exhaust manifold end of the tube.
try those things and let us know how it goes.
- marlinh
- Highest Ranking Member
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Re: 1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtn
Sounds like a spark plug wirebreaking down under load.
- Petros
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- My tercel:: '84 Tercel4wd w/extensive mods
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Re: 1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtn
Welcome to the Forum!
Sounds like those mechanics do not want to work on it, they clearly do not know what they are talking about. Best diagnose the problem and fix it yourself. Do not attempt to fix anything until you have diagnosed the problem, otherwise it is a waste of time and money. That being said, some items are inexpensive to replace and serve as a test (like fuel or air filters).
It could be the spark plug wires as Marlinh notes, easy change if they are questionable. It could also be the coil or ignition pick up breaking down, but I would look for everything else first. It does not sound like a fuel starvation issue, as a partially plugged fuel filter might cause (so as you found the fuel pump change was unnecessary), though there is a possibility of a leaky fuel line between the tank the fuel pump (causing it to suck air under heavy loads), or even a plugged up fuel inlet screen in the fuel tank. you can inspect the fuel inlet by removing the rear cover under the carpet in the back of the car (without removing the fuel tank). It might be worth a look with a flashlight to see if there is a lot of loose material floating around in the fuel tank.
Also, with a timing light you can double check the mechanical distributor advance is working, if not it will lose power at higher rpms. That is usually an easy fix by lubricating the advance mechanism in the distributor.
Sounds like those mechanics do not want to work on it, they clearly do not know what they are talking about. Best diagnose the problem and fix it yourself. Do not attempt to fix anything until you have diagnosed the problem, otherwise it is a waste of time and money. That being said, some items are inexpensive to replace and serve as a test (like fuel or air filters).
It could be the spark plug wires as Marlinh notes, easy change if they are questionable. It could also be the coil or ignition pick up breaking down, but I would look for everything else first. It does not sound like a fuel starvation issue, as a partially plugged fuel filter might cause (so as you found the fuel pump change was unnecessary), though there is a possibility of a leaky fuel line between the tank the fuel pump (causing it to suck air under heavy loads), or even a plugged up fuel inlet screen in the fuel tank. you can inspect the fuel inlet by removing the rear cover under the carpet in the back of the car (without removing the fuel tank). It might be worth a look with a flashlight to see if there is a lot of loose material floating around in the fuel tank.
Also, with a timing light you can double check the mechanical distributor advance is working, if not it will lose power at higher rpms. That is usually an easy fix by lubricating the advance mechanism in the distributor.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
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- My tercel:: 84/2WD/Wagon-stock/311+K miles-original engine/original owner/ no mods
Re: 1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtn
I don't know what TOO OLD is on these cars..mine is 30 years old and 312+K miles.
I agree with Petros on the dizzy and marlin on the plug wires. Plug gap might also be a problem but it also sounds like an air to fuel issue..which may be a clogged Cat. Convertor...in my experience.
check the condition of the plugs ... if there are differences in the 4 plugs mark which one..and record the condition of all of them.
If its up a hill ONLY then the vac advance may be dead or unplugged if you have a HAC (high altitude compensation) in your model.
If you had an automatic 2WD there IS a difference between the 83 and 84 models on the vaccuum system..and it do make a difference.
BTW what altitude does the car live at?
I agree with Petros on the dizzy and marlin on the plug wires. Plug gap might also be a problem but it also sounds like an air to fuel issue..which may be a clogged Cat. Convertor...in my experience.
check the condition of the plugs ... if there are differences in the 4 plugs mark which one..and record the condition of all of them.
If its up a hill ONLY then the vac advance may be dead or unplugged if you have a HAC (high altitude compensation) in your model.
If you had an automatic 2WD there IS a difference between the 83 and 84 models on the vaccuum system..and it do make a difference.
BTW what altitude does the car live at?
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- Newbie
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- My tercel:: 1983,4wd, No mods yet
Re: 1983 4wd Bucking like crazy up hills, and I'm in the mtn
THANK YOU EVERYONE!
I have a terrible time getting to the internet. I drive so little. I am the age of my car, only 29... and leave the house about one day a week.. and don't have internet access!!
I FIXED THE PROBLEM! My awesome neighbor told me that I should change the spark plug cables, because they were corroded (or something). AND IT WORKED!!! ! HOORAY!
My car is at about 6,000 feet. There were a few hoses disconnected too, and I reconnected them (!?) This didn't change anything noticeable, but I'm sure it'll help in the long run.
Thank you everyone!
I have a terrible time getting to the internet. I drive so little. I am the age of my car, only 29... and leave the house about one day a week.. and don't have internet access!!
I FIXED THE PROBLEM! My awesome neighbor told me that I should change the spark plug cables, because they were corroded (or something). AND IT WORKED!!! ! HOORAY!
My car is at about 6,000 feet. There were a few hoses disconnected too, and I reconnected them (!?) This didn't change anything noticeable, but I'm sure it'll help in the long run.
Thank you everyone!