Another head gasket replacement...

[Petros]

Well this last weekend finally saw my 4th head gasket failure in about 3 years. It had been marginal for some time, using water, but running okay, until a particularly hot day running with poor gasoline. I have gotten to the point where I can replace the head gasket in 2-3 hours, but I am getting a bit tired of it.

I am going to try a full metal, all copper head gasket, they are custom made by this outfit: http://www.headgasket.com/index.html
It should arrive next week.

I am running 11.2:1 compression ratio on the Tercel and using premium fuel. This is usually not a problem for most engines but all I can figure is the 3AC head is just too flimsy to keep the gasket in place. It always fails between the one and two cylinders. Hopefully the metal gasket will permanently solve this problem so I can have a high powered engine without blowing the head gasket.

Failing that, I will have to switch to a different engine to get more power, a 4-AFE perhaps? It eliminates that carb and that crappy valve train.

[Typrus]

Crappy valve train? It's good to 8k with good springs.. lol
Sorry to hear it man. Thats where the 85's fresh longblock blew the gasket as well. They claim it was detonation, so they won't warrant that, but the whole engine is still under warranty. Ticks me off... But, it's back together and just needs a few things that I can't do till my buddy brings me back some of my tools...
You're good. Took me 4 hours of futzing around just to put it back together. lol. Disassembly only took 20 minutes though. Pulled the head with everything attached.

How much was the all-copper if you don't mind my asking? Thats what the high-boost turbo guys run, so I think you should be good in that department.

I can't find all the pics you took of your setup...


Is it possible that all these failures has put a little channel in the head between 1 and 2 allowing for easier breaching? I've seen in happen. The super-heated gasses carve into the aluminum ever so slightly.

[Petros]

The copper gasket should cost $105. I consider making it myself, but after consideration I felt that was good price for the amount of work it would be to cut-out by hand. I found another site that had one for 4ac that should work for I think about $75 but that is a multilayer steel gasket with some kind of rubberized coating. The copper gasket is reusable as long as you do not damage it taking the head off, this should save me money in the long run.

I always resurface the head and block with 800 grit sandpaper with a polished granite sanding block. If there was erroded metal it would show up when I sand it. I have had the head machine shop resurfaced twice and the block once, it did not make any difference. I know it is detonation is my case, that is why I run premium, considered also adding octane booster but that add too much cost. With the copper gasket it should not matter.

What I mean by crappy valve train is the power robbing, poor breathing 8 valve set-up. The small carb and intake manifold does not help either. Limits the amount of power you can get out of it. Also I have issues with the exhaust valves, I have burned two, and seen other Tercels that sucked an exhaust valve and trashed the engine. I have never seen this on any of the 16 valve heads of the later Corrolas. This is why I would like to go with a 4AFE engine, or head perhaps.

[takza]

Maybe a groove and some rounding in that head to reduce the compression a little?

[Typrus]

If I remember right he's practically turned it into a hemi with all the removed metal lol.

[Petros]

Yep, done both groove and removed as much metal as I feel safe doing from the combustion chamber.

I describe the mods here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2949&p=22668&hilit= ... ves#p22668

lets see if I can get the pics of the failed head gaskets to show up, notice also my flat top pistons.

I have never actually seen the metal part of the gasket complete eroded away like that, hopefully the copper gasket will stop this.

[Typrus]

Thats essentially what happened on the 85...

[Mac]

if your going to make more power out of the engine, you can't expect it to last as long.

If there is a detonation issue, look into retarding the ignition timing a bit, and possibly upgrading the cooling system.

[Neu]

hey mac, haven't seen you in a while, how's napa treating you?

[gatemaster]

It had been marginal for some time, using water, but running okay,

Mine is using a little water and it started running a little hotter about the same time. Maybe I had better pull the head while I have the engine out.
I used one of those new layered type gasket for alum. heads (actually I didn't have a choice) with a slippery surface and it said not to use any gasket sealer with it. I didn't like not using sealer. Now I am wondering about which head gasket is the best for sealing and still accomadate the different metal properties.
I wonder what is worst, a sliding, leaking gasket or a sealed non moving?

[Mac]

hey mac, haven't seen you in a while, how's napa treating you?

oh man, turned into drama whore central! its a really long story but basically it became a horrible place to work (i was actually dreading going to work in the morning, first time i've had that feeling) and the manager started doing really werid ass shifts, gave me the crappy 10-7 shifts, broken up weekends and kept trying to make me work for more than 7 days in a row and told me i couldn't take a lunch break on weekends!

got the hell out of there in a hurry, took the first job i got offered which was a delivery driver for a portable toilet compnay, that was fine untill they hired a douchebag with an army background and a passive agressive complex and then the guy laid me off because he said it was "slowing down"

not really having much luck these days...

[Neu]

I'm sorry man, that sucks. Really does.

Just remember you always have tercel4wd to come back to!

[Petros]

It had been marginal for some time, using water, but running okay,

Mine is using a little water and it started running a little hotter about the same time. Maybe I had better pull the head while I have the engine out.
I used one of those new layered type gasket for alum. heads (actually I didn't have a choice) with a slippery surface and it said not to use any gasket sealer with it. I didn't like not using sealer. Now I am wondering about which head gasket is the best for sealing and still accomadate the different metal properties.
I wonder what is worst, a sliding, leaking gasket or a sealed non moving?

With Al heads and cast iron block you have to allow the gasket to slide some, or it will fail from the differential expansion rates of the two metals. The only way you can get a head gasket to bond if if you have an all cast iron block and head.

I make both the top of the block and the head smooth so the surfaces can slide without ruining the gasket. I use 800 grit sandpaper with a piece of polished granite counter top as a sanding block. Makes a good flat finish on the head.

[Typrus]

Makes you wonder why the copper ones are so successfull... The multi-layered ones allow for some internal expansions within the gasket itself... What about a solid chunk o' metal?

[Petros]

The solid copper is supposed to cool better, it transmits heat to the block faster so it will not melt as easy. I suppose it would be a bit stronger since it is a solid peice instead of layers, so it will not structurally deform as easy. It is used by the turbo installers and the NOx injector guys since the factory head gaskets blow out. I suppose it should hold up better, if it work for a tubo engine, it should work for mine with the stock carb.