Lifting a Tercel!?!

takza · Post by **takza** » Sat May 01, 2004 3:54 am

I'll post my actual height specs if it stops raining long enough.

It stopped:

Avg front: 21.75 cm

Avg back: 26.1 cm

Around .6 cm of this height is from my 14X5 wheeels with 195/60 tires.

<a href='http://350zx.com/tire-wheel.html' target='_blank'>http://350zx.com/tire-wheel.html</a>

And here I thought I was riding high.........

Looks like new springs all around plus the current boosters?

Something to try on the back:

<a href='http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... reId=10101' target='_blank'>http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... d=10101</a>

Might manage 2.5-3 cm above stock height.

Meanwhile.....

Here are the "doughnut" rubber boosters I used in the front (2 per side):

<a href='http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... reId=10101' target='_blank'>http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... d=10101</a>

These fit like thay were made for the Tercel front spring...a little soapy water and they are in.

These are the "saddle type" spring boosters I used in the back:

<a href='http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... reId=10101' target='_blank'>http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... d=10101</a>

They can also be used to lower.

offroadTercel · Post by **offroadTercel** » Sun May 02, 2004 4:16 pm

Ok, here are the tire specs:
27" Super Swamper Radial SSR
Size: 27x9.50R14LT
Ply Rating: 6
Skid Depth: 21/32
Tread Width: 7.9
O.D. : 27.5
C.S. : 9.5
Rim: 14x6.5-8.5
Max PSI: 50

So this is for 14" wheels, we may do 15" but we actually need to figure out what wheels would fit both the tercel and the tires.
I have to ask, what about using leaf springs for the rear suspension? It would make it simpler, no?
We are still thinking of putting a 22RE in... and the CV shafts need replacing anyways.
In order to minimize fender chopping and having the rear tires hitting the gas tank and doors, it seems around a 6"-8" lift would be nice.

3A-C Power · Post by **3A-C Power** » Sun May 02, 2004 8:15 pm

Leaf springs would require adding a mount to the rear of the wheelwell where none exists. There is a nice box section rail there that may be strong enough already. If the frame could take the forces, it would be an easier way than making new links. Leaf springs put a lot of extra load on the frame because of the loads along the spring.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon May 03, 2004 12:41 am

I agree, going too big would destroy all that is loveable about the little ATM on wheels. It would be nice to have a touch more clearance and more tire options. When we lived up in the Sierras the only thing that ever stopped me on the back roads in the snow was high centering. We called our car "the ingot" because it was a gold brick. I drove the snot out of that thing! Dropped a K Watanabe used motor in it for $225 and got another 100k out of it. I am in the market for one if anybody knows of one in SoCal. There is a subaru website that shows all kinds of lifted subies, there must be a way to take a tercel a few inches up.

aussie 4x4 · Post by **aussie 4x4** » Mon May 03, 2004 6:31 am

Hey Takza.
Just looked at your post. Sounds like your under the original size. Are you Sure that you measured correctly. When you sat CENTRE, i take that to be the centre of the pivot. ie, the centre of the bolt which holds the arm in place.

If that is in fact what you measured, then u can get much higher yet. I would only be too happy to assist you with any questions you might have with raising your tercel higher. I did mine for under 300 Would be only too happy to answer any other questions.

This is a great message group. Hope that it can grow into a large group like tercelonline.!!

takza · Post by **takza** » Mon May 03, 2004 12:15 pm

aussie 4x4

Yep...I'm still below stock height...measured from the center of the bolts.

Sort of explains why the car handles so well (other than the tires & wheels)...stiffer springs and slightly lower than stock.

Probably will go with new springs in the front when I do the front struts...OR I could try the rubber pieces under the spring or at top like you did on the back, if possible. Know of a source for a rubber material used for hay balers that would work. Either way I'd put the "donuts" back in I think.

For the back I might try the 750 lb spring boosters as I posted a few posts up. If they will fit the rear shocks OK. These should allow some height adjustment on the back without buying new springs.

Also going to do the front swaybar upgrade that I mentioned elsewhere....fairly soon. Have you done anything to your front swaybar?

* <span style='color:blue'>Soon</span> means...when I get some other stuff done....

From how you describe the front springs you put in, it sounds like they were a heavier spring than stock????? Otherwise, they shouldn't have caused problems with the strut being overextended?

I've searched on OEM springs in the US and have found 3 prices ranging from $59 to $82 US each. Haven't found a higher or stiffer spring yet.

Thereminator · Post by **Thereminator** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:00 pm

Takza,wont those 14" J.C. Whitney uni-springs fit our struts? For $60 Bukaroos Im inclined to go that rout.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue May 04, 2004 1:36 am

Takza.

Look like you need to gain some height!!!!!
The difference in ground clearance is considerably noticable once your in the bush. Anyways, the new springs i put in are King Springs. They Are made in Queensland Australia.
<a href='http://www.kingsprings.com/' target='_blank'>http://www.kingsprings.com/</a>
They are made of a heavier steel making them much stiffer (but not too stiff), I ordered new springs with the intention to bring the car back to normal ride height, however once they were fitted, they were higher than ride height. I did go back and ask questions about the spring. They told me that they were original height and that if i wanted them to sit lower, just to take them off again and they would have them fixed. But i didnt want them lower HIGHER WAS THE GO!!!!!!!!

So i made the modification to suit the new springs.
I wouldn't mind the idea of the stiffeners on the back though, would be good when carrying heavy loads, but also make the back end a bit twitchy when going over bumps i think.

As for the front sway bar mods, The only thing that i have done is to replace all the bushes. They were all stuffed!!! nackered, rooted, etc.
I don't find that my car needs this done, it handles like a dream, far better than my girlfriends mazda 121!!!

Not sure how far you want to go with the spring idea, but i wouldn't think that it would be a problem if you wanted to get the king springs from Oz. I would HIGHLY recommend them!!!

The rubber donuts are a good idea for the back!!. Definately would not work on the machpersons if putting on the top of them. Using tham as you are now, in between as a stiffener is a good idea, but i would think that the spring would tend to want to pop out of the macpherson if you did it here. New springs are the go. Japanese make GOOD cars, but CRAP springs!!

If buying new springs check the thickness of the steel. Make sure that you buy springs that are stronger. Thicker steel!!! the originals are a very weak spring.

can you repost you new heights? i am interested.

All you tercel owners need to rise to the new level!!!!

takza · Post by **takza** » Tue May 04, 2004 7:15 am

Checked out the KingSprings catalog for the AL25 (Tercel 4WD ?) and they are listed as original height. There is a place in a city near here that can make and heat treat new spring to your specs, supposedly for not much more than new spring prices (heard this long ago). I could also just use the rubber donuts in new springs to get some extra height.

Shipping from AU to the US might be a bit high????

Know what you mean about the "twitchy" thing...can see this with empty pickups that have heavy overload springs on the back. The "donuts" would be next to impossible to get into the back springs...though I have used a hacksaw to cut down one side of them so they will go in springs with smaller gaps between the coils...they still stay in place with the hollow on one side holding them.

I guess for offroad, the swaybar mods might be the wrong move since you probably want the wheels to be more independent, not less? Doubt though if taking 1/2" of play out of the swaybar would harm things much offroad.

My guess with springs offroad, is that you'd want tall springs that compressed pretty easy so that you'd reduce the tendency for any one tire to lose contact with the ground? Not easy to find????????

Could you post some details on the front strut mods you've done?
Like the height of the packers you used (approx)...are these just a round section of solid alum? Do they just sit below the strut inserts or are they held someway? Maybe the height of the flat washers used on the top threads (approx).

Not sure what I'm going to do, but fairly sure I'll go with some new springs when I do the front struts. Will try the rear 750 lb spring boosters...can always send them back if they don't work out. Also do the strut mods.

------------

Here in the US, we have to to find a "round tuit" before we can do anything. Thats why you hear people here always saying that they will do something when they get a "round tuit". I've seen lots of people in their backyards on Saturdays looking all over for "round tuits"...a lot of them just give up and go sit down in an easy chair.

Old fart joke..........

Have a list of things to do that doesn't seem to get any shorter. If I'm not looking for tools, I'm looking for round tuits.

takza · Post by **takza** » Tue May 04, 2004 7:22 am

Thereminator wrote: Takza,wont those 14" J.C. Whitney uni-springs fit our struts? For $60 Bukaroos Im inclined to go that rout.

They are only $25 for the pair...issue is......will the clamps clear the sheetmetal? Are they going to be really adjustable? Will they boost too much?

Checked the diameter of the shocks on my car and the 750 lb coils will fit them.

Have to buy them to find out......they will take stuff back no questions asked...if in original condition.

aussie 4x4 · Post by **aussie 4x4** » Wed May 05, 2004 6:01 pm

Hey takza. A Little busy at the moment, will post more details when i get a round tuit!

aussie 4x4 · Post by **aussie 4x4** » Sat May 15, 2004 12:32 am

sorry bout the delay takza, had a lot of work to do at the moment. Here are a few details on the front strut mods i did in order for the lift to work successfully.

Firstly i removed the strut insert. I then cut out a packer around 5mm of solid aluminium plate round (i did it with a bansaw, could also be done with a hole saw) The height of the packer depends on the nut which bolts the strut insert into the strut housing. You must ensure that the nut has enough turns of the thread in the housing to ensure it holds the strut in properly. You need more than 2 or 3 turns.!!!! This has in turn effectively raised the strut insert up, further toward the top of the macpherson.

Next packer used was 3 washers. I used 3 1/2" HT washers. All in all about 6mm of packing. This reduces the amount of thread used on the top of the strut insert which ends up on the bearing allowing the strut to turn. You can see this nyloc nut if you pull the rubber cap off the top of the strut inside the engine bay. You might notice that you have a bit of extra thread sticking out of the nut. My strut doesn't quite make the nyloc insert on the nut, however i put mine together with loctite and have never had a problem.

Another way to do this would be to cut some of the bottom of the nut off in a vice so that you could do the nut up to the nyloc.

So, the main idea is to utilise the extra mm taken up by excess thread. i hope that this explanation is clear.

It is necessary, when the new springs are in and you do these modifications, that when reacembling the suspension, you set the camber. Set it so that the top of the wheel is closest to the car. Turn the eccentric washer so that the marker faces straight down. If you don't do this, you may get a lot of tire wear on the outside of your tires.

So when these mods are done, you shouldn't have any problem woth the strut topping :rolleyes: out!!!!

Thereminator · Post by **Thereminator** » Sat May 15, 2004 2:02 am

So what you call a "Packer" we call a "Spacer" right,Aussie?

takza · Post by **takza** » Sat May 15, 2004 7:27 am

aussie 4x4...thanks for the detailed info. Very useful. Do know that there is supposed to be a minimum number of threads for steel that will hold full strength...might be 3-4 for steel and 5-7 for alum????? Obviously, you'd want to use at least a few more threads for insurance realtime.

Saw a strut rod extension for sale somewhere that screwed onto the top of the strut rod and extended it....probably wouldn't fit the Tercel though.

The specs for the front camber are for slightly postive camber...have you found that doing this mod causes the different tire wear?

I've ordered the 750lb rear boosters to try...vaguely remember asking someone about these and was told the 750lb rating was overstated...so I'll find out.

aussie 4x4 · Post by **aussie 4x4** » Mon May 17, 2004 7:20 am

Yeah sorry a packer is a spacer. My slang is a bit auzzie i suppose.

Just on the positive camber thing, I have very even tire wear. I have had a wheel allignment done professionally, and have no problem at all with uneven tire wear. So, if all is done as described, i can't foresee there being any problems.

Takza, keep me updated with the boosters. Don't think i am going to make any further suspension height modifications.

Just fitted new lower Ball Joints to my Tercel. MUCH MUCH better ride now. No cluncky front suspension!! its great. The passenger side ball joint completely rooted!! Would recommend anyone doing suspension upgrades or Sway bar Upgrades and repairs, to take the time to remove them and check them for movement. You cannot do it whilst the suspesion assembly is attached. It was a bit of a prick. but well worth the effort. Ended up easier to remove the lower control arm with the ball joint attached and replacing it at the bench in a vice.

Anyways im off.
Hop! to here more soon!