dlb wrote:your flywheel can probably be machined. if not, there are tons of 3a engines at wreckers so grab a flywheel from there. i would machine a used flywheel before using it.
I agree but my hope is that mine is not trashed and can be machined. I would think if my clutch disk were at metal, I would know that from the way it was operating. Mine is just bucking and grabbing when starting off in first or reverse indicating a high spot in the flywheel caused by overheating it. I'm thinking if the disk hasnt eaten into the flywheel, that I can machine mine.
that behavior sounds like clutch chatter. you need a new clutch, and likely to have the flywheel resurfaced. also replace the rear main seal while you are there, and possibly trans input shaft seal.
two reason why you get clutch chatter, poor quality clutch fatigued and started coming apart, or you got oil on the clutch from an oil leak. so make sure you fix any leaks before you replace the clutch or the new one will go bad too.
Petros wrote:that behavior sounds like clutch chatter. you need a new clutch, and likely to have the flywheel resurfaced. also replace the rear main seal while you are there, and possibly trans input shaft seal.
two reason why you get clutch chatter, poor quality clutch fatigued and started coming apart, or you got oil on the clutch from an oil leak. so make sure you fix any leaks before you replace the clutch or the new one will go bad too.
Makes sense....what kind of puller do you need to get the flywheel off the end of the crankshaft once you unbolt it? Also, how hard is the rear main and the trans input shaft seal to do? Far as any leaks, I will have to check it out once I get into it.
there are six 14 mm bolts that hold the flywheel on the back of the crank. Once the clutch is off these bolts are exposed, the big trick is to keep the engine from turning as you break them free with a breaker bar. I usually put a large screw driver or a pry bar in the flywheel teeth and break each one free in turn (alternate sides of the bolt circle). the flywheel can than be pulled of by hand, no puller needed (sometimes a whack with a large soft hammer helps).
the rear main seal is right behind the flywheel, do not follow the factory service manual procedure, you will cause the pan gasket to leak. just get behind the seal with a thin screw driver or a hook tool ( a thin screw driver that you bend the tip in a 90 degree hook works), and pull it out, leaving the seal holder in place. Before you do that make sure the new one is the correct size.
clean off the seal seat with solvent and a wire brush, and clean off and polish the surface on the flywheel where the seal runs with 400 grit wet and dry with solvent. than clean it really good with solvent and paper towels.
I like putting a tiny smooth bead of gasket sealer around the outside of the seal to it kind of "glues" it into the housing. Put grease on the inside lip of the seal so it will not be dry against the crank shaft (without lubricant, it will damage the seal when you first start the engine). Make sure the seal is pushed or tapped all the way down into the retainer.
when you reinstall the flywheel make sure you use a torque wrench on the flywheel bolts, and the clutch cover bolts as well (find the torque specs in the FSM).
okay so I have gotten the transmission out. It was not too bad but the part that was the worst was trying to engineer a way to lower it out and get separated from the engine. I read your information indicating that if your throw out bearing and pilot bearing are good keep them vs replace with after market. I have checked mine out and they appear to not have any sign of being shot. I'm just wondering whether I should take that advice or replace it with the parts that come in my new kit from Rockauto. I would certainly hate to get it back together and then have issues and have to take it apart again. But that could happen either way.my clutch disc is not completely gone but it was down to the rivets on the side that messes with the flywheel. Definitely in need of being replaced. I'm going to get the flywheel machined sometime this week or early next.one other question is about the gear oil. I pulled drain plugs in about 3 different places starting with the front transaxle then the center transmission then the rear transfer case in order to get the oil out. I have no idea how much came out but I'm wondering is there one central location on the transmission that I use to refill it when I get it back in the car, & I presume I continue filling at that hole until it starts coming out perhaps the front axle holes in the transaxle then I know it's full. Would this be a correct assumption, I will go to the factory service manual but I have found some things to be very vague in their.
i would personally replace the throw out and pilot bearings with the new ones in your kit.
if your clutch disc was down to the rivets, it was definitely time to replace it.
i like to fill the trans from the front left fill hole, just behind the CV axle hole. i find it the easiest to access when the trans is in the car. make sure to have the rearmost drain plug undone 7-8 turns while filling, then do it up afterward. the entire trans takes 4 L. be sure to clean the drain plug magnets before you refill the trans.
I have had trouble with both after market T/O bearings and the small pilot bearing that goes in the back of the crankshaft (that engages the front of the trans input shaft). I replaced the clutch, and even though the original factory pilot and T/O bearing felt good when I turned them with hand pressure, I put in the new ones in the kit. Within less than a year the T/O bearing started making racket, and lived with for another year. Than the pilot bearing started screaming a high pitched whine, not wanting to pull the trans to replace it I lived with it for a while. but soon I needed to pull the engine for another reason, so I took the opportunity to put the original factory pilot bearing and T/O bearing back into it (that is what I had handy). I have been driving on them since, car has well over 360k miles on it now.
so unless you have the same brand of bearings in your kit as the factory uses, I would not use them at all, not worth the risk, too much work to find out they are junk in a year. if yours in the kit are made in Japan, they are likely a good bet, but only if your current ones are noticeably bad anyway.
I have not found the same problem with the after market clutches, they all seem to be decent and durable no matter the brand or where they come from. I have installed perhaps six or seven different clutches on project Tercels or other peoples, or my daily driver and never had an issue, they last over 100 k miles each, perhaps longer if you are easy on it.
I have only used factory type (brand) bearings since, or reused the old ones, each time I replace a clutch. I am now on my 3rd clutch on my daily driver, but still have the original pilot and t/o bearing, no sound at all when I push in the clutch.
dlb wrote:i would personally replace the throw out and pilot bearings with the new ones in your kit.
if your clutch disc was down to the rivets, it was definitely time to replace it.
i like to fill the trans from the front left fill hole, just behind the CV axle hole. i find it the easiest to access when the trans is in the car. make sure to have the rearmost drain plug undone 7-8 turns while filling, then do it up afterward. the entire trans takes 4 L. be sure to clean the drain plug magnets before you refill the trans.
Yes, I am leaning towards all new bearing from the kit too. I think it will be fine. The rear main seal looks good, got to decide if it is worth replacing and chancing creating a leak.
Let me be clear on the hole to use to fill the trans....you are talking about a hole on the Driver's side of the trans, and not the one that is basically in the transaxle about half way up the side of it, but the next furthest one back which is right next to the bracket that holds the diaphram mechanism for the air line off the catalytic converter? To me, it does not look high enough up the side of the trans to get 4L of gear oil in.....4L is a ton of oil and I know I did not get close to that out of it from three separate drain holes in the bottom. If I put the trans back in the car and fill from that hole, I cannot see the oil being able to get deep enough in there with the natural tilt of the trans to back up all the way to the transaxle deep enough to come out of the axle holes. There is actually a plug on the very top of the trans, but no way to get to it when the trans is in the car....its too far north of the gear shift hole where it mates up to the hole in the trans tunnel for the stick shifter.
Petros wrote:I have had trouble with both after market T/O bearings and the small pilot bearing that goes in the back of the crankshaft (that engages the front of the trans input shaft). I replaced the clutch, and even though the original factory pilot and T/O bearing felt good when I turned them with hand pressure, I put in the new ones in the kit. Within less than a year the T/O bearing started making racket, and lived with for another year. Than the pilot bearing started screaming a high pitched whine, not wanting to pull the trans to replace it I lived with it for a while. but soon I needed to pull the engine for another reason, so I took the opportunity to put the original factory pilot bearing and T/O bearing back into it (that is what I had handy). I have been driving on them since, car has well over 360k miles on it now.
so unless you have the same brand of bearings in your kit as the factory uses, I would not use them at all, not worth the risk, too much work to find out they are junk in a year. if yours in the kit are made in Japan, they are likely a good bet, but only if your current ones are noticeably bad anyway.
I have not found the same problem with the after market clutches, they all seem to be decent and durable no matter the brand or where they come from. I have installed perhaps six or seven different clutches on project Tercels or other peoples, or my daily driver and never had an issue, they last over 100 k miles each, perhaps longer if you are easy on it.
I have only used factory type (brand) bearings since, or reused the old ones, each time I replace a clutch. I am now on my 3rd clutch on my daily driver, but still have the original pilot and t/o bearing, no sound at all when I push in the clutch.
good luck.
Hmm, def a consideration. Maybe I can tell by looking at the new bearings that show up as to whether they are made in japan somehow....is there a list of names that are made in Japan that you think would be worth their weight.....such as Nachi, Timken, etc.? My car only has 123K on it and I am not going to be daily driving it. I would not think the pilot and TB/release bearings would be shot....but who knows.
sorry, it's hard to picture which fill hole you are talking about. the one i am referring to is directly aft of the driver side CV axle. to fill from this hole, i have attached a long nozzle to a funnel and sat the funnel by the starter, battery, and brake master cylinder. i believe most who fill from this hole jack up the front and left side of the car while doing it, to get more oil to the rear of the trans and to simply make it cleaner.
if you did not get 4L out of your trans, you likely have a leak. the axle seals, FWD/4wd selector seal, and rear driveshaft seal are the most common leak points in my experience. the last tercel i bought had been sitting for years and when i drained the oil, there was only 2 L or something and i could see the 4wd selector seal had been leaking. replaced it, filled the trans, no leaks after that. another transmission saved.
