Perhaps I will drive to the junkyard tomorrow

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 9:55 pm

You know what is awesome? Not my car! Perhaps a couple readers here will recall me complaining about my carburetor rebuild in another post...well I have been messing with that for a few days now...trying to get the rebuilt carb to work that is. Some might say it is worse than before....but today finally with another guy I finally started to narrow it down...took it apart a few times again this evening to adjust the float properly, and then turns out something had clogged my accel pump jet...nice. Got that...got it running,,,seemed to run okay, not the best cuz it still wanted to die when I opened the throttle slightly while in the garage...the accel pump would spray fine but the thing would just slow down and slower and slower and slower as long as I held the throttle open...then I would close the throttle right before it died and it would think for a moment, then resume normal operation. Hm.
If I "choke" it with my hand, it will run better. So I suppose it is lean, although it wasn't lean before I rebuilt it. Well maybe it was but it wasn't like this!

Well after it warmed up for like 15 more minutes, it seemed to be in such a state that I could go drive it about the neighbourhood, so I did so...nice and easy, lemon squeezy...
still wants to die when I go to accelerate. Then I get to some nice open road, so I get it past the "i'm gonna die on you" part, then open it up all the way, not bad! for a tiny car...then when I get to 2nd gear at high revs, uh oh! the alternator light and the brake light come on simultaneously, which I JUST READ yesterday means I will have to replace my alternator....I think to myself "self, I don't think this car is worth that much."
Okay...so anyway, not running real well, limp back to my garage...then notice the temp gauge is quite near the top. Hoping against hope that it is just an electrical malfunction, related somehow to the alt/brake lights, i pull into garage and pop the hood to look at it....
doh! coolant bubbling out of reservoir
So that's just great.
I don't think I want to play this game anymore, it was fun, but now it is not...it's not like I ~NEED~ the car, I just bought it cuz it made me laugh, I wanted to play with it....it doesn't deserve this much attention, that is for sure.
Plus, like I said, the "frame" is shot, the body is shot, the rear axle is shot, the tranny is shot, the front axle is shot, hm what else....oh well the carb I guess, the alternator, now something with the cooling system?
It steers nicely though...and it has an alpine.
Sure nobody here wants it?

Gasoline Fumes · Post by **Gasoline Fumes** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 12:13 am

Did your belt jump off? That would take out your alternator and water pump.

takza · Post by **takza** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 6:36 am

I think it has a death wish.......... :ph34r: I'd start thinking of walking away from that one.

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 10:27 am

Walking away is a wonderful idea that is for sure...but I have slept now, and I figure, I MIGHT try to fix it....

I like that belt jumping off idea Mr GasFumes, that is wonderful! I admit that when I popped the hood last night I was way too tired and irritated and in a off-state of mind to notice a missing/off belt...hmm I like that idea...if it is that, then no big deal and the alternator can be replaced with a junkyard one or I could probably do something about it myself, who knows.

Okay I will go check that out

3A-C Power · Post by **3A-C Power** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 11:40 am

The problems you're describing sound an awful lot like a vaccuum leak. They seem to plague these cars and baffle us when everything else seems right with the carb. You can have a vacuum leak even when you've checked all the hoses and made for darn sure you don't have a vacuum leak. If it runs faster when you put your hand over the carb, that's a sure sign.

I understand the dilemma you're in. As soon as the temperatures dropped where I live, all the crap that I've neglected on the car became more overwhelming because it gets worse in the cold and fixing it now means fixing it in the cold. That's when I started thinking about newer Subaru wagons and checking some out. If there was anything newer that was anything like the Tercel wagon I would probably give up because all the work on an old car isn't worth it. As of this moment I'm still planning to get a rust free Tercel body, paint and rust protect it really well and do the 4A-GE swap. If I build up the car until everything is working well and then start driving it with everything good, that will be easier to keep up because if something goes wrong, I'll know that after I fix that thing, it will be really good again. Driving a car where lots has been wrong with it for a long time is harder because you know if you fix one thing, it still won't be very good, so you don't get motivated to fix any one thing.

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 6:12 pm

Speaking of newer cars like the Tercel, I just happened to see a car the other day, and it made me think: "Is the new Toyota Matrix basically just a new version of the tercel?"
Cuz it is four door, tiny, hatchback, says 4WD on the back, yet has little/no more ground clearance than a normal Toyota like a Corolla.
Obviously it would be vastly superiour in every way...but let's not start a war on that point! just my personal view.
I've had my eye on Subarus too, but they are all so expensive! and larger than what we have now...I kinda like the way the tercel is so tiny heh good for the kind of offroading I do, which is basically just going to crazy trails on the way to a good hiking/camping spot in the black hills or wherever...I recently use my Nissan Pathfinder for that but it gets tight sometimes, and it is alot smaller than alot of suvs.
Ya know what I want desperately though, and when I see one for a reasonable price I am going to jump on it so fast.....Rav4.
Or Honda CRV but I like the Rav4 better

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 6:32 pm

Okay well anyway "belt jumping off" WAS the correct answer, give that man a prize! I don't know why....I put that thing on maybe a month ago. Hm perhaps I had one of the teeth off or something; it is one of those ribbed serpentine-style belts.
So I drove it around today, and it is getting better, so I may allow the car to live....for now.
So! perhaps I should have started a new topic, but hopefully people who know about carbs are still reading my "i hate my car" rant. I think all the problems boil down to this one thing:
At part throttle, it will just sputter. I went up and down the street over and over, all gears, all speeds, all rpms, it doesn't matter....any time I have the throttle part-way, it stumbles, coughes, stumbles, sputters. It would probably die if it weren't getting pushed along by the momentum of the car. If the throttle is oh-so-carefully pushed just a hair over idle, it will be fine...so going about the neighborhood (slowly) is fine....and at WOT it goes quite well. But anything inbetween....in other words, where 95% of my driving will take place....bad bad bad.
EGR vacuum line is currently disconnected.
SO! Does that ring a bell for anyone? Surely someone can say "oh yeah that is obvious when it does that" and thus my car will be fixed and fun again.

I was thinking along the "large vacuum leak" lines myself, and I noticed that the fitting that screws into the manifold for the hose that goes to the brake booster, that was completely loose...so I screwed it in all the way and nothing changed. Then I sprayed nearly a full can of carb cleaner all over the engine, on everything, and I did manage to find a leak on part of the intake manifold, where it bolts to the head...but I don't think it was enough to cause the super super super bad "sputtering at part throttle" I am getting. That is too big a difference at the various throttle positions to be caused by a small constant leak at the manifolds...
(okay maybe I am lazy and talking my way out of another annoying job and spending money on gaskets for a car that is on its last legs)
I notice that there are strange diaphragm things on that carb, that pull various throttle and/or choke things open or closed at various states....which is just crazy if you ask me. I verified all of those diaphragm things with my vacuum pump and they all work fine and don't leak...but maybe the "more complicated than it should be" system of switches and solenoids and whatnot that control those carb things isn't working right?

3A-C Power · Post by **3A-C Power** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 11:10 pm

The Tercel 4WD line continued, but degenerated. In Japan the Tercel 4WD was called the Sprinter Carib, and that name was given to the 3 generations of Corolla AWD wagons that came after. If you look at those, they still retain stylistic similarities to the Tercel - sort of high roof, thin taillights at the side. But the Matrix is just an Americanized version of the latest Corolla line, designed for style to appeal to the younger generation who adore impracticality. The Tercel 4WD is tall all around for room and cargo space and has large rear windows for the best visibility. In the opposite fashion, the Matrix's windows get smaller as they go further back, with the rear quarter windows appearing as little peep-holes. Did they make it like that to reduce visibility, to make it look like garbage, or both?

I fixed my carb today, but lucky for me it was just the automatic choke that was screwed. Now it starts, and that's a big improvement.

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 11:52 pm

3A-C Power wrote:the Matrix's windows get smaller as they go further back, with the rear quarter windows appearing as little peep-holes.

I have noticed that "foogly" Pontiac Vibe does that too. I can't for the life of me, figure out why people buy those. Maybe they like not being able to tell if somebody is behind them in that corner...heh heh! I have an suv that is kinda like that.
What's that other Pontiac or Buick that is similar but even more ugly....um....Aztek yes, my sister knew somebody who adamantly swore up and down the his chrome yellow Aztek was the best car on earth, bar none.
I'm like "yyeaaahhh."

As to your choke, good work. Now fix mine and I will mail you some cookies.
Is anyone still reading this besides us two?

takza · Post by **takza** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 6:53 am

Adelard of Bath wrote: So! perhaps I should have started a new topic, but hopefully people who know about carbs are still reading my "i hate my car" rant. I think all the problems boil down to this one thing:
At part throttle, it will just sputter. I went up and down the street over and over, all gears, all speeds, all rpms, it doesn't matter....any time I have the throttle part-way, it stumbles, coughes, stumbles, sputters. It would probably die if it weren't getting pushed along by the momentum of the car. If the throttle is oh-so-carefully pushed just a hair over idle, it will be fine...so going about the neighborhood (slowly) is fine....and at WOT it goes quite well. But anything inbetween....in other words, where 95% of my driving will take place....bad bad bad.
EGR vacuum line is currently disconnected.
SO! Does that ring a bell for anyone? Surely someone can say "oh yeah that is obvious when it does that" and thus my car will be fixed and fun again.

I hope you drilled the mixture plug while you had it out...there's a short writeup on that in the repair section...a little richer might solve the problem?

Maybe it is the EBCV thinga-ma-bob?

Dirtmagnet · Post by **Dirtmagnet** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:12 am

Adelard,
I do not know if this would cause the effects of what you are seeing, but on the carb, the 4 screws that come up from the bottom, holding the throttle plate to the main body. One of these(of the 2 larger ones) is hollow for a vacuum passage. The instructions that came with my carb rebuild kit did not show which went where, so getting these swapped could be very easy. The FSM does show which side the hollow bolt is on.

I do not know if this would cause the poor running if these were swapped. Just a thought.

I have became very attached to my carb. In the last 2 months I have had it off no less than 4 times. Just when I think I have gotten it set, it changes. I think my problems may be in the emmissions part of it. I do not have to pass an emmissions test, so I need to plug or turn off the junk that I do not need. Problem is, I do not know what all I can and can't turn off.?

3A-C Power · Post by **3A-C Power** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 10:32 am

One way to find a vaccuum leak, not that it always works, is to point a propane torch at different things with the engine running. When the propane hits the leak, it should make the engine run faster. There might be better things to use than propane, like maybe starting fluid. I would be suspicious of the carb base to intake manifold seal, just because that's given me trouble before. Did you use a new gasket there? Are all the bolts tightened evenly?

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 5:56 pm

New gasket, bolts evenly tightened, and no matter how much I spray carb cleaner around the base, it doesn't leak at all.

Takza: what is the EBCV or whatever? every toyota engine I have seen has a million little vacuum switching devices, and they all have some acronym like "vvsv" or "ebcv" or any combination thereof. I downloaded the factory service manual last night, so I will have to take a look at that, maybe I can figure something out.
I didn't drill out the mixture plugs...actually I am hesitant to mess with that, cuz it worked (mostly) before, and I don't want to go about randomly changing screws, cuz I will NEVER get them back once I start doing that. But maybe...

DirtMagnet: I know the hollow screw of which you speak, and when I was putting it back, I said "uh oh"....but I did my best to remember...but sometimes I wonder if I got it wrong. Maybe I should just pull the carb and switch it around....hee hee
luckily it isn't TOO hard to do, all my vacuum lines are labeled already so just those four nuts and the hoses and a couple big hoses, and we are good to go.
At least I haven't taken it off four times yet like you have!

You know, awhile back, I had this 1986 Dodge Ramcharger with a 2bbl carb, everybody on the web thought it was the crappiest carb known to man. Well...I managed to rebuild that one without any problems...I think because of one thing and one thing only: that one didn't have 32768 little extra valves/diaphragms/emmissions things on it. Air went through it, sucked gas into the air...that was that. One accell pump...
So I think if you could figure out all the crap to unhook, and just make it a plain-Jane carb again, it would run quite well!

Dirtmagnet · Post by **Dirtmagnet** » Thu Dec 30, 2004 6:01 am

3A-C Power Posted on Dec 29 2004, 12:32 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One way to find a vaccuum leak, not that it always works, is to point a propane torch at different things with the engine running

My cousin Billy-Bob told me about this and said it works. He lit the torch and was pointing it around, nothing happened so he reach around and revved up the engine. Bout that time the flame got sucked into the primary barrel on the carb. When he came to, sure enough he saw his vacuum leak. The intake was totally separated from the block. He is on a first name basis with the local 911 operator.

As usual, with all redneck species, the last thing we heard him say was "Hey y'all, watch this".

Just kidding, but if you do try this, DO NOT light the torch.

Adelard of Bath · Post by **Adelard of Bath** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:19 am

I usually use carb cleaner myself...that could theoretically explode too...but at least I am not waving a flame around fuel lines and bowls and stuff!

Well the factory service manual is quite impressive, a real improvement over the "useless chiltons"
In fact, the section on rebuilding the carb looks very cool printed out, front and back on 15 sheets of paper, stapled, on the bench out in my garage hee hee
I was somewhat disappointed that they didn't bother to explain theory, though, I guess garage mechanics either already know or don't care, but as an engineer I would be very happy to know WHY this-or-that is in the carb.

Well regardless, I was saddened to find out that I had the screw with the vacuum passage in the CORRECT spot; no luck there, DirtMagnet!

But I found out that the phenolic plate or whatever that thing is called, the baseplate for the carb that is made out of some type of Bakelite or plastic, has a gasket on the OTHER side of it...doh! how could I miss that last time...but carb cleaner sprayed there didn't make any idle change so I guess it wasn't leaking....well it is getting cleaned up and replaced this time, luckily the carb kit came with like four of those gaskets; now I know why.

Then I took that heat shield off the manifold and found that oh my goodness! there is a gasket on the BOTTOM of that, too!!!! that wasn't replaced ever! man this system, okay this is kinda poorly engineered, First of all, four-cyl engines work out nicer when you have the intake on the OPPOSITE side of the head as the exhaust...ESPECIALLY with carb dammit...I mean carbs suck in the first place, then they have this one in the 3a-c positioned directly over the exhaust manifold? great. at least they have a heatshield.
Oh then there are like 15 gaskets just to mount the carb, each one having lots of potential to leak. Yay.

So maybe I will track it down yet...oh and I found a hose disconnected, although I don't know what it does...but it is on one of those EGR bits...not the valve itself, but there is a round thing next to the EGR valve, with two vacuum lines on top, and then one slightly larger hose coming out the bottom, the one on bottom was off. I must have done that the first time I removed the carb...I am hoping! Cuz that would explain why it was WORSE when I put the rebuilt carb back on.

I guess I will retorque the intake mani bolts while I have it all apart, since I did find a small leak there.