help: stuck far from home

[SethM]

Hello,

Well, ... trying to drive my "new" 1985 T4WD home (maiden voyage) and just tried to start the car (drove it yesterday for about a two hours no problem). It almost caught but died. I figured it might be the choke (not a cold morning but....). Hit the key a second time and NOTHING, no cranking at all, not even a clicking at the solenoid. Lights, fan, wipers all work, seems to be juice in the battery. Checked the ignition fuse in the driver's side kick panel. Anybody on the forum this holiday weekend? Up early on a Saturday? Could use some pointers if anybody has any ideas (before I call AAA).

Thanks

[SethM]

Some additional details (after doing a search and reading some other related posts here, I thought the following might help to rule out certain possibilities):

I have power to the ignition switch. When I turn the key, some sort of blower/fan/motor comes on (the fan switch on the dash is set to off but something else is coming on in the background when I turn the key to the full start position). Also have lights, wiper and heater fan so the battery seems fine (or at least there is enough juice to expect to hear at least a click at the solenoid-- see below).

There is NO sound from the starter. I am pretty certain there is no power at all going to the starter. But I can't figure out why-- the fuse in the panel on the inside near the driver's left foot seem fine. The lettering on the cap of the fuse panel in the engine compartment is worn so I can't read which fuse is which but all of the fuses in this panel look find (don't know what the round silver can things are.....).

Ideas, anyone?

[Don Jorgensen]

Could be the solenoid. I've been able to get several more starts out of solenoid/starter drive by tapping on the starter with a wrench while someone is engaging the ignition switch.

Also if it is a manual transmission, 85's have a switch on the clutch pedal so you have to have the pedal down to get juice to the starter.

Before I'd pay someone, I'd push start it. Have ignition on and get rolling in neutral then clutch, pull tranny into 2nd gear and pop the clutch. Don't use 1st gear because it will turn over easier using 2nd.

[SethM]

Thanks. I thought about push starting but I've got about 1000 miles to go.... could get old (and interesting at gas station stops).

I wondered about the clutch switch but assumed it was like many 'neutral safety switches' where you can start in neutral without having the clutch pedal down. Will investigate further. Will try the sloenoid 'tap'-- my thought there was that it wouldn't work because there was NO sound at all at the solenoid which seemed to suggest that current wasn't even making it to the solenoid.....

[SethM]

OK- questions about the clutch safety switch... where is it? The FSM only mentions a switch for the automatic trans. BUT the FSM does offer a 'troubleshooting' suggestion for my situation-- the 'fusible link' is this just the fuse in the driver's side kick panel or is there something else?

I can't seem to do searches on the FSM pdf file and so can't find more on the clutch switch but it sure seems like something like that that is cutting off power to the solenoid.

[takza]

If for some reason the solenoid isn't getting current, but you have ignition current...you could buy a roll of wire around 20 gauge and run it straight from the battery + post to the connector on the solenoid. Leave the ignit ON...in neutral...brake ON...touch the wire...see if it starts. Don't short the wire out...it will get HOT real fast if you do.

Tapping the solenoid works too if it's stuck....as mentioned.

[jetswim]

Thanks. I thought about push starting but I've got about 1000 miles to go.... could get old (and interesting at gas station stops).

At least try to start this way so you know the engine runs.

[toughtercel]

hi , i fully agree with "Jetswin / DON J " just puch the car and jump start it self in 2 nd gear weather motor is ok , another way is crank the crankshaft pulley by your hand if can turn freely .
any way i think starter/alternator brand name call "boosh" i kind of like the brand but for some reason they offer life time warrenty , they are rebuild ,they nothing but headaches for last two years on two tercel cars i had to replace 5 times , i tap on starter then vroom works , finnaly i switch the brand and new built , no trouble no bubble.

[Neu]

85's dont have a clutch safety. i've started both of mine in gear and in neutral without pushing in the clutch.

[SethM]

OK, thanks to all for the input/suggestions. I have been "offline" because I was using my phone to access the forum and had trouble logging in (at the moment, I'm on the laptop at a truckstop that has wireless).

It turned out to be the solenoid and the "trick" was to to tap it (more like beat it) as suggested here by several. I TRIED tapping it but am traveling alone so would tap it, then turn the key. At a shop, the mechanic hit it WHILE I turned the key (I believe Don suggested this very thing....) and, presto, it started. Has started with the key since then (yesterday noon) except for one time where I had to push start it but I had parked facing down a slight grade.

I learned that there are 2 starter/solenoid combos.... why I wonder? The regular and the "reduction starter" as per the FSM. From the diagrams in the FSM, it LOOKS like I have the reduction starter which seems to mean only that I get to pay significantly more. Anybody know why Toyota offered two models, how they decided which to use in which cars, and if you can switch from one to the other?

Thanks to all. I'll have more (plenty more) questions if/when I get home with this thing. Running OK (may have a vacuum leak somewhere as there is an odd miss and the tach "hunts" between 850 and 1000 rpms most of the time at idle). Biggest problem is what appears to be a leaky front seal which is getting worse. Pumping oil in like gas and hoping to make it home tomorrow.

[keith]

Before you spend a lot of money on a new starter or reman, check the connection of the ignition wire, the small wire that comes from the ignition switch. The spade inside the housing can back out so it only looks like its on, but inside, its barely touching. Push on the wire and not the connector to see if it goes in any further.

[takza]

Thanks to all. I'll have more (plenty more) questions if/when I get home with this thing.

You have taken the red pill....yes....you will have many more questions as time goes by.....


"You take the blue pill and the story ends. You wake up in your bed and you believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill and you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes...... Remember, all I am offering is the truth. Nothing more...."Morpheus-The Matrix.

[SethM]

Final Update (on this particular part of the "red pill" journey...):

Made it home yesterday. 70 miles per quart gets old after a few days..... For the first 200-300 miles I was getting 28 mpg but that jumped (after running a can of SeaFoam through the tank??) to 32-35 for the rest of the trip. Who knows, maybe if I kept driving the oil consumption and gas consumption curves would have crossed!

Thanks to all who responded.

1) sorting out red pills and blue pills
2) contemplating time and place to do the repair on the front seal and what else to do at the same time (previous owner SAID he had recently replace the radiator, timing belt, other belts....)
3) will check the connections on the starter as suggested by Keith.... After the first "tap on the solenoid", it started with the key for a while but by the end of the trip I was push starting it (simply because I was traveling alone and couldn't tap the solenoid AND hold the key in the start position).
4) have to figure out some nagging electrical issues--- the radio has no power, the cigarette lighter has no power but the fuses are good.

I'll post questions on some of the above to the main board as I go along. Have to take a photo too and post to the general thread.

[ARCHINSTL]

Welcome to our journey!
Tom M.