1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

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brucnich
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My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

Hey so this is just about my Tercel and updates on it. At first I was going to make it an overlander but I think to make that even worth it, it's going to be a bit to much money. That was also before I encountered a fuel problem today. At first I figured I was out of gas as my fuel gauge doesn't work. I filled it up after my dad rescued me with a gallons worth. It started up, then it started up again after I went to the maverick, then started again once I got home so no worries. I then drove it to my gfs picked her up started it again then got about 1/4 a mile and as I was explaining what went wrong earlier same thing happened.
So now I figure that hey it 's my fuel filter, figured I'd need to replace it anyway, long story short 5$ repair and 5 minute job turned into me not being able to find my fuel filter. I know now I sound stupid but stick with me here it gets stupider. I accidentally mistook it for my fuel pump cause it was the closest I could get to finding it. Fuel came out of where the spring was I was like "oh okay thats good fuel in my fuel pump okay and I guess I found out where it was but now wheres that filter?!" So my gfs neighbor is a mechanic, shoutout to him for helping me find it after 2 more hours of looking. Now some of you are thinking wow, crappy mechanic cant find the fuel filter right next to the starter motor. Well, now I have to some more backstory. I bought it a couple months ago for 900$ from this rich tech guy. He wanted 2750 earlier which was stupid high for the car. Anyway he said he rebuilt the carb and replaced the fuel pump. Well frankly he did a...confusing job because instead of putting in a new fuel filter, he bypassed it with a little hose. Which I am confused on, this mechanic was confused on, and he still hasn't gotten back to me on why. Anyways mechanic tells me I need a new fuel pump cause it wouldn't start with the filter and yknow fuel was in my oil as mentioned earlier with the fuel pump. Also theres a clog somewhere now due to the lack of a fuel pump so carb rebuild time. Might just spend 100 and let someone who knows what they're doing rebuild it. I also need to change my oil now after the maybe 1000 miles driven on it so I feel good that I wasted my money.
Anywho thanks for coming to this ted talk as of 2/20/21 that's where I am at, hopefully the engine aint shot. Please if you guys have any info on why it was bypassed and just other stuff that might help let me know, thank you!
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
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duragauge
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My tercel:: 1986 Tercel 4WD SR5
Location: Willamette Valley

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by duragauge »

Hi, brucnich.

I'm new to Tercels too, so I might not be much help. But this forum is great and I'm sure someone with more knowledge will chime in before long.

Would you be able to upload a photo of your engine bay? That might help the diagnosis.
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NWMO
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Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by NWMO »

brucnich,

I expect you are likely dealing with vapor lock and poor fuel delivery. First, if you have a timing light, check/set engine timing. Then, if you haven’t yet, install a new fuel filter on the driver’s side inner fender and confirm direction of flow. I would then disconnect the fuel line into the carburetor and add a clear hose on the end of the line from the fuel pump. Then provide temp fuel by hanging a bottle or simply feeding by hand and get the engine started. After running for than a few seconds, you should have a strong fuel flow and NOT see bubbles in the vlear hose. The fact that it has run ok for chunks of time, would make me think you should be ok to this point.

If you struggle getting sufficient fuel into the carb from a hanging bottle, you may find a clogged “screen” filter at the bottom of the carb intake, below the needle connected to the float. You have remove the top of the carb and the float/needle for access. You can then remove the brass “ housing” and look for/inspect s small screen filter that fits over the end. Particularly if yhe other filter was by-passed, you may gind this filter partially clogged. If you have marginal fuel flow, the carb heats up and when you stop/park, the fuel vaporizes leaving the bowl low or empty. After things have cooled some, your car may start a run fine briefly. Good luck, let us know what you find.

Chris
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brucnich
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Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:10 pm
My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

I'll try that Chris and will do tomorrow morning duragauge! I replaced the fuel pump this morning as well as changed the oil, it seems to be running better now and has more consistent fuel flow for sure than before. Throttle also feels for some reason a bit smoother I'm sure that's due to fuel flow cuz I don't really do anything with the throttle body in the carb at all. I will check out that filter though because the fuel flow definitely still isn't 100%. I also developed a severe transmission leak I will upload photos and I'll also look at the forums to see what's up with that and what I need to replace I need to change my gear oil there anyway so at least it's getting it started for me got to look at the bright side haha.Thanks for the help!
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
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Petros
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My tercel:: '84 Tercel4wd w/extensive mods
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Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by Petros »

do not assume your carb is all plugged up just because it ran without a filter. it might be, but if the fuel tank is normal and not full of rust and debris, likely that is not the problem. many of the fuel pumps that came from communist factories in Asia are junk, if it is not a Japanese or USA made fuel pump, even if new, I would suspect it. I have found that 30+ year old factory fuel pumps I get from the wrecking yard are more reliable than the new communist made crap.

if anyone who looked at your engine bay was familiar with this fuel system, or the older RWD corollas, they would know right where to look for the fuel filter, and know it is missing. but that kind of familiarity with vintage toyotas is not common any longer, except on this forum of coarse.

they sell fuel pressure testing gauges at the auto parts stores, and on Amazon and at Harbor Freight as well. they do not cost much and are a useful diagnostic tool to rule out, or verify, if it is a fuel pump, or something else.

there can be other reasons you do not get fuel delivered, and it can be darn frustrating to locate. If you run an extra fuel line into the fuel pump intake and into a gas can, see if it will run like that. if you still do not get fuel delivery, likely it is the fuel pump. if it will run that way, than you know the problem is upstream of the pump.

I had bought an old non-running Tercel4wd in another state, sight unseen and had to sort it out before I could drive it home. I replaced the timing belt, front seal and did a few other checks, and it would not run unless I sprayed starter fluid down the carb. so it was not getting fuel. did the gas can with extra hose check, and it ran off the fuel pump. I replaced the filter, but sill not fuel coming it. I carefully check the fuel lines and found small cracks on the rubber lines that allow air into the line, but acted like a one way valve, so it did not leak fuel. so the pump was sucking air into the line, the fuel filter would not even fill up with gas. I replaced the cracked lines (there are only three short segments, on either side of the fuel filter, and from the hard line to the fuel pump) and it started and ran on the 5 year old gas in the tank.

other possiblity is the inlet to the fuel line in the tank if plugged with debris, you can inspect that through an access hatch under the carpet in the cargo area in the rear of the car. you remove the hatch, and than remove the screws to the tank flange that also hold the fuel level sender. than you can look into the tank with a flash light (avoid sparks or open flames! no smoking). usually it is will fine. you can also clean the contacts of the sender while you are at it, so the gauge reads more steady rather than jump around. there is also a short length of rubber flex fuel line from the top of the tank to the metal fuel line mounted to the underside of the car. it too can age and crank and cause it to suck air. this last one is not common because it out of the light and away from the heat of the engine compartment, but they can go bad. kind of pain to replace that one, you have to drop the fuel tank.

good luck.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
brucnich
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Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:10 pm
My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

Thanks for all the ti ps I'll look at all those and try all those out, and yeah the old pump was some Chinese crap so that explains why it went bad so quick. Well see how the new one does, but I'll like into it, I feel as if its air in the system somewhere as well so thanks for all these tips. I swear ya learn the most about cars once they break
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
brucnich
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Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:10 pm
My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

Oh I forgot to update this, yeah new fuel pump+ a filter for good measure seemed to fix it, it's been dying lately though, some more stuff with carbs, my shop teacher told me to check vacuum lines and there are a couple the forum listed that need to be replaced
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
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Petros
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Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by Petros »

in addition to checking for vac leaks, there are several simple carb adjustments that should be checked. cold idle speed, idle speed, throttle linkage, and the throttle breakes on the front side of the carb (attached to the front end of the throttle shaft) that prevents the throttle from slamming shut too fast. all are easy adjustments, but if any are off it can allow it to stall. go read up on the adjustment procedure in the FSM in the chapter on the fuel system, it does not need any special tools or equipment.

good luck.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
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dlb
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My tercel:: '87 sr5, '83 dlx parts car
Location: bc, canada

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by dlb »

Also remember to check the diaphragms that the vacuum hoses go to. You can do this by sucking on the hose that goes to a diaphragm. You should not be able to suck air through it. If you can, remove that hose and cap off wherever the vacuum would be coming from until you can replace the broken diaphragm.
brucnich
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My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

Alright I'll do that for some reason O'Reilly's and AutoZone did not have a 5/32 size hose so I have to go to home Depot tomorrow, on top of that have to check the thicker hose diameter, I'll also give the FSM a check. I've tried to adjust my idle speed and I loosen the screw all the way and it's still idles at 1100 so I'm confident there's a vacuum leak or there's something else that needs to be adjusted which I'll take a look at and try and adjust it all tomorrow or after my AP test on Thursday.
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
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dlb
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My tercel:: '87 sr5, '83 dlx parts car
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Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by dlb »

Yeah, your high idle is most likely due to a vac leak. Also check to make sure the carb mounting nuts are all snug. And you can spray carb cleaner all around the carb while it's idling and if you hear the RPM's rise, you've found a vac leak. Just some different potential vac leak stuff to investigate.
brucnich
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My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

Sounds good cleaned my carb and throttle body recently and it's doing better, RPMs fell if I remember right tho, anyways gotta buy some hoses today and do it one by one so I don't break anything
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
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dlb
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My tercel:: '87 sr5, '83 dlx parts car
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Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by dlb »

brucnich wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 11:05 am Sounds good cleaned my carb and throttle body recently and it's doing better, RPMs fell if I remember right tho, anyways gotta buy some hoses today and do it one by one so I don't break anything
When it came to tracing and replacing vac hoses, I used to get lost trying to follow a hose from its origin to where it connected to the metal pipes then which pipe it came off of and where it finally ended up. I eventually figured out the easiest thing to do is disconnect the hose at its origin and the supposed destination. Plug one end with a finger tip and suck on the other end. If you can feel the suction on your finger tip, you know you've got the right ends. Doing this, I've found many incorrectly routed vacuum hoses on t4's in the past.
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Petros
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My tercel:: '84 Tercel4wd w/extensive mods
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Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by Petros »

that is correct, a misrouted vac line could act like a vac leak. do not assume who ever worked on it before got the vac hoses back in the correct place.

there is a diagram in the FSM, you ca down load it from elsewhere on this site, trace all the vac lines from start to finish (it does not really take that long), visually inspect each one for cracks or holes, and correct routing. replace any damaged ones. if your engine still acts like it has a vac leak, than with it idling take a can of starter spray and spry little puffs around the carb, and all the vac lines, and vac operated components (a bad diaphragm will act like a vac leak). when the engine speeds up when you spray the fluid at the same spot, that is the location of the vac leak.

good luck.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
brucnich
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Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:10 pm
My tercel:: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 4WD
Location: Salt Lake UT

Re: 1983 Toyota Tercel SR5 something build

Post by brucnich »

Alright so I did end up finding vac leak it looked like a hose was just barely hanging on in there and was almost off due to it not being clipped on, ran a lot better from that point went from 23 to 28 mpg after that so thank you also sorry I just saw that. It does turn out though that whoever rebuilt my carb from before I bought it did a bad job and seeing as how its gonna be 475 to pay someone to rebuild mine Ill just pay 50 or so and give it a whirl myself. As I do so Ill end up replacing and retracing all the vacuum lines I can. Just in case you guys have a better diagnosis than what Im seeing ill share what happened. Engine got hot (below that white bar still) now that its summer, started chugging, pulled over, bought some coolant threw it in. Car fired up no issues. Later that day, same thing chugged but this time died, sat there looking through vac lines they looked good engine cooled down all the way car fired up and drove just fine the rest of the night and to work that morning. After work weather was hot again car chugged at about 10 miles into my drive home shut down and this time did not start again. I checked the fuel pump, it was good, and rechecked vac lines and tweaked idle, got it to start with lots of backfire and such then it died again hasnt turned on since. A mechanic said definitely a fuel issue cause its getting air and spark so...
I dont know what I am doing but I can make vague assumptions let you fill in the gaps for me and let you think I knew it all along...
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