engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

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gnarnold
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engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:57 am

]just wanna know the order of steps to troubleshoot (vacuum lines first or timing etc.)I have to move in four days and need the tercy to help .any and all help in this matter is greatly needed .I know at least one of you masters of the thing called tercel has some hints and tricks that would expedite the resurrection of her royal highness "the tercy"

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Last edited by gnarnold on Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

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Gottolovem
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Gottolovem » Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:22 am

Welcome
You need to provide a little more information on what emissions are on your car California or federal is there a vacuum diagram sticker on the underside of the hood if not find it in FSM in this forum.
Do you know anyone that also owns a tercel to compare vacuum layout.

It would be nearly impossible to walk you through vacuum lines you need a visual reference.

gnarnold
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:46 am

the hood sticker says 3AC 4AC CAL. it is really faded

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I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

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Gottolovem
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Gottolovem » Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:57 am

Definitely looks like you have some vacuum issue's
I would go through the ca diagram one hose at a time.
There appears to be a missing emissions part on the firewall (don't know what it's called)
I also see one unplugged vac port on carburetor
Good luck

gnarnold
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My tercel:: 1983 SR5 4x4 with a tummy tuck and a nose job and now a pace maker!
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:04 am

whoooaa .!!!!sir wait please the diagram is badly faded and a missing emmissions part?it ran fine with old engine until a loud banging brought me to the oil pan where I found pieces of 2pistons in the oil pan .the old engine did havea knock though when I got it .sir I really need your expertise .
I was wondering if maybe you could pm me your email address and I could send you a short video of what it sounds like
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I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

Mr. Mad Ox
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Mr. Mad Ox » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:18 am

take a look at this: http://www.tercel4wd.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2810 and go through them one hose/component at a time making sure they all go where they need to go

gnarnold
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:20 am

thank you so much I will be back soon ,I hope . dont leave me your all I have!! seriously though thank you. ok so right away I noticed that the distributor that came with engine has three ports or nipples for vacuum lines can I plug two or which one
I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

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Gottolovem
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Gottolovem » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:25 am

Post the video here so others can help as well.
It will run fine with the emission part bypassed.
Find the proper vacuum diagram for a ca car in the service manual in this forum.
At the very least cap off any unused vac ports on the carburetor I see one on the photos.

There are others with far more knowledge on vacuum lines than myself here on this forum.
I belive there advise will be the same get a good diagram and track one hose at a time.

I think the part that I see missing in the firewall is one of the vacuum switching valves mayby #11 in the diagram.

gnarnold
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:59 am

oh and where can I find tyruss set up that bypasses all that crap?
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is this the missing component
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I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

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Petros
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Petros » Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:38 pm

that large line is the air inlet for the catalystic converter, that will not affect the way it runs (though it you try and pass an emissions inspection it will give you issues).

cap off the extra vac port on the distributor vac advance (if you leave it open it will act like a vac leak). that third vac port is for the altitude compensator which your car does not have, so capping it off is acceptable and necessary.

And go through the vac diagram for your car (which you can find on this forum over in the repair guides section), and make sure they are all routed properly. the open one on the carb should have a vac line that comes off the vac manifold running along side valve cover. Make sure they are all routed properly and there are no leaks. Usually that will solve any drivablity issues or engine surging/cycling.

good luck.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)

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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by xirdneh » Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:02 pm

something to think about
a problem i have had when swapping engines and carbs
is the two fuel cut solenoids on the carb can be reversed
two wire soleniod and single wire solenoid
some cars the two wire is on back of carb and on some cars the drivers side
this has caused idle problems for me
Love those Tercell 4x4 wagons but they sure suffer from road noise.

gnarnold
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:29 pm

ok guys ,well the vac lines are good .so good that it doesn't want to even out it just goes higher and higher .and when I turn it down it surges .please tell me im going in the right direction .
I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

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Gottolovem
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Gottolovem » Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:40 pm

Try xirdneh's suggestion
xirdneh wrote:something to think about
a problem i have had when swapping engines and carbs
is the two fuel cut solenoids on the carb can be reversed
two wire soleniod and single wire solenoid
some cars the two wire is on back of carb and on some cars the drivers side
this has caused idle problems for me

http://tercel4wd.com/viewtopic.php?f=4& ... +solenoids

gnarnold
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Posts: 325
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2014 7:28 am
My tercel:: 1983 SR5 4x4 with a tummy tuck and a nose job and now a pace maker!
Location: jordache ,ca

Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by gnarnold » Wed Jan 08, 2014 8:16 pm

ok switched solenoids evened out quite a bit but as the temp gets up there and it goes up pretty quick it starts to surge a little at first then stronger
it does seem better though
just read that there is emission stuff I can "yank out" I needto get it running right ill deal with emissions in a year(not literally yank out unless need )
also , my dad seems to think it is the computer, his theory is different engine different computer.is there any computer issues that you have ever come across?
I used to laugh at the man with a pinto :lol: , until I became a humble servicer of a tercel :|

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Petros
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Re: engine swap 3AC to 3A wont idle just wanna...

Post by Petros » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:06 pm

the computer does not matter, it usually reliable since it is really just a simple set of switches based on temp and vacuum input. They had different ones for different years but if the carb set up you used is the same as the year computer it should run correctly.

You do not want to just rip everything out, some systems (like the EGR valve) can be removed without affecting drivability, but other systems are essential to be present since the carb and engine were designed to operate with that stuff pressent.

If you are getting surge in the 2000-2600 rpm range only, it is from that item in the last picture (on the left strut tower) that is malfunctioning. It controls the mixture in that range by leaning it with an air bleed under the carb, if it malfuctions it will act like a vac leak right at those rpms, a temp fix is to remove and cap off the vac line to that vac switch on the right in the picture right in front. It will than run normally but will reduce your fuel economy until it is fixed.

If you are running an unknown carb I suggest installing your old one, carbs can have internal problems that will make it undrivable. These carbs and vacuum componets are generally pretty reliable and work well if all of the parts are working properly and the vac lines are connected properly. That is the first place to look, veryify all vac lines are routed properly, no leaks, and that each of the components are not leaking and working correctly. the FSM has a procedure to test each one, usually they are very simple tests that only takes a minute or two to run or measure. So you have to work your way down the list of items from the troubleshooting guild that indicated it could cause the type of problems you are having.

It sure sounds like a vac leak, but there are a few other times that can cause that to occur. A bad fuel cut-off solenoid is one of them.

Do not randomly try things, it is a wast of time. properly test and diagnose the problem BEFORE you try and fix it. Randomly changing things in a desperate attempt to find the problem will only result in frustration, only try or test one component at a time so you know you are not making it worse.

Good luck.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)

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