upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

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simon84
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upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by simon84 »

I was just re-installing the upper radiator hose pipe fitting where it goes onto the top of the engine and I snapped a piece off the head. The bolt was going in a bit tight and so I backed it out to make sure no threads crossed. Seemed ok, just tight so I went for it and before it was fully in there, the lug on the head where it attaches snapped in half.
20210226_121842.jpg
I'm not really interested in replacing the head.
Any thoughts on welding the piece back on and chasing the threads and making it work again?
I guess I can see if it seals with only one bolt but I have my doubts.

Any suggestions appreciated...
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Driver: 87 Tercel SR5, white, 4ac, weber carb (aka the Tercedes)
Road Tripper:95 Mitsubishi Delica L400 2.8L Turbo Diesel
Motorbike: 94 Kawasaki Ninja ZX6
Project Car:Red 68 Plymouth Sport Fury III
Previous Tercel:Orange 84 Tercel 4wd (aka the pumpkin)
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NWMO
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by NWMO »

Simon,

I would try JB Weld and hope for the best. No paper gasket? or is it there and I just missed it? After the epoxy sets up, chase the threads and likely use a new bolt.

Chris
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simon84
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by simon84 »

Thanks NWMO.

Yeah, my brother just suggested JB weld and I think I will try that first.
I used a paper gasket and also some gasket sealant.
I'm pretty sure this issue originated because of the O ring on the bypass pipe. It seems to be a common leak point. Last time I was replacing this pipe fitting/flange, I found an O ring that was a little bit oversized and it went on quite tight but no leaks. This time I noted that the O ring seemed to be looking ok (maybe flattened down a bit in while it's been in there for at least a couple of years). I tried hitting the fitting with a rubber mallet to seat it on the bypass pipe better, but I think the whole fitting is sitting a bit high. This must mean the two mounting bolts are sitting a little high and putting extra stress on the mounting holes.
My plan is to drill out the top mounting hole so that the bolt is not under so much stress and then try JB weld.
If I can pull it off and no leaks then I'm happy.
If not then I will likely take it to a welding shop and see what they can do.

I will report back on my progress.
Driver: 87 Tercel SR5, white, 4ac, weber carb (aka the Tercedes)
Road Tripper:95 Mitsubishi Delica L400 2.8L Turbo Diesel
Motorbike: 94 Kawasaki Ninja ZX6
Project Car:Red 68 Plymouth Sport Fury III
Previous Tercel:Orange 84 Tercel 4wd (aka the pumpkin)
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NWMO
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by NWMO »

I would lean towards correcting any by-pass tube fitment issues so the housing lands per stock placement. Likely easier and better in the long run.

Chris
Psalm 37:4 "Delight yourself in the Lord and he will give you the desires of your heart"

In remembrance of my friend ARCHINSTL:

T4WD augury?
"Oh, do not ask, 'What is it?' Let us go and make our visit."
T.S. Eliot - "The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock"

"Now and then we had a hope that, if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates."
Mark Twain
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Petros
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by Petros »

that is a bummer. I would try welding it and than drill/chase the threads. there should not be a lot of pressure on that fitting, it just needs to hold in place enough so the sealing surface does not leak. the problem is this is the hotest part of the head, so temperature cycling will likely cause JB weld to fail. the fitting would have less than 100 lbs of outward pressure on it, but the vibrations and the temperate cycling would do in any adhesive fix. regular high temperature epoxy might hold up better, but really I can only see a good weld holding it in pace would work.

If you can not get it welded, I would consider grinding the location of the broken boss flat, and than drill and screwing down a small block of aluminum. than cross drill and thread it for a bolt that holds on the fitting. kind of a rube goldburg fix, but that way you have metal to metal securing of the fitting.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
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simon84
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by simon84 »

I got some high heat JB weld. It's a stick of putty with 2 layers (epoxy and hardener) and you break off what you need and knead it with your hands then plop it on. It did not work. I cleaned up the area and took a small burr grinder to it to add some tooth. I gave it plenty of time to harden and it came off. On inspection, it was not all hard, so I think I did not knead it very well. May be best to get it nice and warm and pliable and really go for it if I use it again.
Here's a pic.
20210313_181914.jpg
So then I took it to a local welding shop and they welded it back on. They also soldered on the drain tap handle for my shiny new aluminum radiator that had the handle spin when I tried to use it first time. All that for $280, so a bit of an expensive mistake but I'm glad it's fixed.

Here's the results of their welding.
20210323_131731.jpg
Brought it home and managed a few kilometers on the highway to get it warmed up. Looks pretty good to me and no leaks so far.
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Driver: 87 Tercel SR5, white, 4ac, weber carb (aka the Tercedes)
Road Tripper:95 Mitsubishi Delica L400 2.8L Turbo Diesel
Motorbike: 94 Kawasaki Ninja ZX6
Project Car:Red 68 Plymouth Sport Fury III
Previous Tercel:Orange 84 Tercel 4wd (aka the pumpkin)
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dlb
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by dlb »

Were you able to drive the car to the welder, or tow it? Either way, I'd be thrilled to do that and pay $280 to have someone fix it, and save myself the work of removing the head, so this is a happy ending in my book!
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simon84
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by simon84 »

dlb I agree. I'm just willing to own the mistake I made when the piece snapped off the head.
I can always pretend that most of the cost was for the radiator drain tap, which was none of my doing.
Driver: 87 Tercel SR5, white, 4ac, weber carb (aka the Tercedes)
Road Tripper:95 Mitsubishi Delica L400 2.8L Turbo Diesel
Motorbike: 94 Kawasaki Ninja ZX6
Project Car:Red 68 Plymouth Sport Fury III
Previous Tercel:Orange 84 Tercel 4wd (aka the pumpkin)
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Petros
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My tercel:: '84 Tercel4wd w/extensive mods
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by Petros »

I did not think the JB would work, that is not a good application. there are a few other things I may have tried before the weld, but it is ultimately the more reliable way to fix it.

I wonder why it broke in the first place, I know you wrote that it was binding. that should have been a clue, but live and learn. I have done that too in the past-- do not feel so dumb...aluminum does that much easier than most realize.

I would have backed the bolt out and ran a bore brush though it with solvent, inspect the threads on the bolt (sometimes they get buggered) than put some lubricant on the bolt (antiseize compound), and than see if it goes down smoothly. if not I would have carefully chased it with the right size tap. if I did not have one I would have went and bought one. $8 for tap is far better than breaking it off.

I have buggered more threaded holes in aluminum than I care to remember (I got lots of stories). I bought a thread coil kit just for that reason, you drill out the buggered threads, follow with an oversized tap, and than install an insert. it makes it much stronger. unfortunately for this one the mounting ear broke off, rather than just the threads getting buggered.

Fixed now, good for you. now go forth and bugger aluminum threads no longer.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
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splatterdog
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Re: upper rad hose pipe fitting on head.

Post by splatterdog »

Glad it worked out. Filling/building up completely then drill/tap is probably how I would've done it.
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