Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

How-to's and repair secrets for your 4WD can be found here. Have a question? Ask it in here!
Post Reply
Epheme
Newbie
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:53 pm
My tercel:: 1984 4wd

Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by Epheme »

Just bought my first 4wd Tercel last weekend. Seller was honest and said it did run on starter fluid, so I figured at worst a new fuel pump and a carb clean would be needed. It has had antique plates on it and had apartment parking stickers for at least the last 3 years and was towed in April from an apartment complex nearby then sold to me at a local tow yard when the owner did not pay their impound fees. I don't think it was really running well since ~2006 because of the receipts and inspection failure sticker in the cargo area.

It runs and sounds amazing - so I am pretty confident in spark and timing - if you work the accelerator pump or put fuel down the vent tube. The mechanical fuel pump had failed so I put an inline electric pump and installed a pre-carb filter, and it started overflowing out of the charcoal canister :o

After carefully marking all the vacuum lines, I pulled it off and it was clear someone had tried to get it going before. It had a very shiny throttle cable, but the rest of it was pretty dirty. When apart there was about 1/4" of black tarry substance in the bowl, the needle was installed without the bail around the float valve so it wasn't getting pulled down or pushed up correctly, the secondary solenoid was bent at about a 45 degree angle, the secondaries were stuck shut, just a list of woes. Fortunately I work in a shop so while I was waiting for the rebuild kit to come, I took it apart and soaked it in our sonic, heated parts cleaner, and cleaned it and soaked it and cleaned. The emulsion tubes, jets, power valve, etc were all bench tested and flowing.

When reinstalled, the float valve was working correctly per the sight glass, but still it would only run (and poorly) if my colleague held it at about 1/2 throttle.

I bench tested the primary solenoid and it checked out good. To eliminate it as a suspect i just sealed the hole with a bolt of approx the same length, but now I am wondering if that was the wrong move. I am going to have to bypass the secondary at least for as it sounds like the solenoids are NLA. Should my bolt have worked or are the solenoids an integral part of the system? Is there a way to drill out or remove the core so they are, in essence, always on?

I do have a Weber carb coming this afternoon - should I just not worry about the stock carb and enjoy my $250 performance upgrade? It bugs me that I can't get it to run right but from doing all my research on the forums and watching the great Youtube videos Xirdneh and others have posted, I'm pretty sure that it's the carb and not me.
User avatar
ALiveSR5
Top Notch Member
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:58 pm
My tercel:: 1985, SR5, 4WD, 6-speed manual, Wagon.
Location: Pennsylvania USA

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by ALiveSR5 »

Epheme wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:48 am I'm pretty sure that it's the carb and not me.
After I installed an engine that had been sitting for awhile, into my Tercel, it would not start easily or remain running, after it did. As you said, I had to hold the throttle open to keep it running. It turned out to be the jets were clogged with varnish (or something). After the jets were removed and cleaned thoroughly, it started and idled normally and has been running well ever since 1999, without issue.

I hope that helps.
No other vehicle that I have ever owned had a heart and soul like my 1985 Tercel SR5 4WD Wagon. :D
~
Great minds may think alike but it is the doers who see their visions become reality. :?
Epheme
Newbie
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:53 pm
My tercel:: 1984 4wd

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by Epheme »

Thanks - that's what I thought too, but it still doesn't run after I thoroughly cleaned the jets. They worked as they should when I sprayed brake clean thru them.

I also drained the old gas out of the tank (ew), flushed the tank and lines with the new pump (no rust flakes/chunks, thankfully), and the gas going into the carb looks clean.
User avatar
ALiveSR5
Top Notch Member
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:58 pm
My tercel:: 1985, SR5, 4WD, 6-speed manual, Wagon.
Location: Pennsylvania USA

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by ALiveSR5 »

Epheme wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:04 am Thanks - that's what I thought too, but it still doesn't run after I thoroughly cleaned the jets.
To clean the jets, tiny little files had to be used to get all of the build-up off.

There are much more knowledgeable and experienced people on this forum, than me.

I just thought that maybe something simple, like I had done, could do the trick.

I have nothing more to offer on this, then.

Best wishes.
No other vehicle that I have ever owned had a heart and soul like my 1985 Tercel SR5 4WD Wagon. :D
~
Great minds may think alike but it is the doers who see their visions become reality. :?
User avatar
dlb
Highest Ranking Member
Posts: 6660
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:03 pm
My tercel:: none currently, 7 previous
Location: bc, canada

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by dlb »

If you have a Weber on the way, I would go ahead and install it, and then get a rebuild kit for the stock carb. Then you can rebuild it in your spare time and put it away somewhere clean so that if you ever need that carb for some reason it's ready to go.
Epheme
Newbie
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:53 pm
My tercel:: 1984 4wd

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by Epheme »

dlb wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:14 am If you have a Weber on the way, I would go ahead and install it, and then get a rebuild kit for the stock carb. Then you can rebuild it in your spare time and put it away somewhere clean so that if you ever need that carb for some reason it's ready to go.
As i mentioned in my first post, I rebuilt it, but clearly there's still an issue. I'll post back if the Weber fixes the issue. Thanks!
Epheme
Newbie
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:53 pm
My tercel:: 1984 4wd

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by Epheme »

Popped the Weber on - great kit. Had it running within an hour. Guess there was something in the carb body that I just couldn't get cleaned out.
User avatar
ALiveSR5
Top Notch Member
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:58 pm
My tercel:: 1985, SR5, 4WD, 6-speed manual, Wagon.
Location: Pennsylvania USA

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by ALiveSR5 »

Epheme wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:47 pm Popped the Weber on - great kit. Had it running within an hour.
Congrats. Enjoy your T4 :!:
No other vehicle that I have ever owned had a heart and soul like my 1985 Tercel SR5 4WD Wagon. :D
~
Great minds may think alike but it is the doers who see their visions become reality. :?
User avatar
dlb
Highest Ranking Member
Posts: 6660
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:03 pm
My tercel:: none currently, 7 previous
Location: bc, canada

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by dlb »

Epheme wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 11:30 am As i mentioned in my first post, I rebuilt it, but clearly there's still an issue. I'll post back if the Weber fixes the issue. Thanks!
Oops, sorry about that. I guess I skimmed over your initial post. Glad to hear the Weber has solved things now though.

After re-reading your post, it sounds like you were thorough in rebuilding the carb but the dying without more fuel makes me think the problem was a massive vacuum leak. When you marked the vacuum lines, did you mark where they had been when you started taking it apart or did you personally trace all of them? If I have any doubt as to where a line starts or ends, I disconnect both ends and blow into one of them and put a finger over the other end to confirm that air is then coming out there. It is a little time consuming and annoying but I have found many incorrectly routed vac lines on t4's this way.
Epheme
Newbie
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:53 pm
My tercel:: 1984 4wd

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by Epheme »

I used the FSM to verify vacuum routing, replaced all lines to carb with blue silicone, did find one broken hose going into distributor, still wouldn't run. I suspected vacuum as well, but *shrug* I don't live in an emissions state thankfully, so if anyone needs a stock carb I'll be happy to pass it along. The one thing I did differently for the Weber was to make rtv gasket sandwiches at every opportunity.
Erikwi
Top Notch Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:31 pm
My tercel:: 1988 stock auto
Location: lacrosse WI

Re: Runs when fuel is put in vent tube - solenoid?

Post by Erikwi »

i could use a spare stock carb i have been experimenting with jets on mine.

drilling the secondary made mine better but not quite right yet. still feels a little lean at WOT (i have ported my head and intake)
Post Reply