unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

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dlb
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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by dlb » Mon Dec 02, 2013 8:02 pm

atoyta wrote:I have had good luck with the redline synthetic mtl
atoyta, did you change to synthetic after using traditional gear oil in your terc? if so, how was the cold shifting with traditional vs synthetic?

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by atoyta » Tue Jan 07, 2014 9:46 pm

I had the trans rebuilt & ran it with the normal 80/90w oil for the first 500 miles & then replaced it with the Redline. It did shift better in cold weather with the synthetic.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by Tercel__jon » Wed Jan 08, 2014 8:00 am

So I just want to toss this info out there...what with my running 80w-90 traditional and our stupid low temperatures we've had teh last few days here in north carolina. The gear oil is so thick, the car wouldnt start. Had to hold the clutch down. After the engine was warm I let it out in neutral and the car tried to move forward...and promptly stalled. Restart...made sure it was in neutral...let it out annnnd tried to move forward and stall. Restart, rev up to about 4k. Dump the clutch (in neutral) and floored it. It bogged down to about 1500rpm and then recovered. Held it to about 2k rpm for a few minutes until it would idle. That shows how thick gear oil gets in 10 degree weather. I didnt bother driving the car since Ive got the same stuff in the diff.

On the flip side of this, I have the same gear oil in the trans of my f150. No problems. Then again its a simple 3 speed and thus has less parts than the tercel trans.

Well thats my experience. Ill be going 50/50 traditional and synthetic with the lightest weight oil I can find for next winter. Though it doesnt usually get down that low here.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by marlinh » Wed Jan 08, 2014 8:32 am

My 86 tries to stall first thing in the morning when it is cold out too. If I let out the clutch it tries to roll forward. I just have to keep the revs up a bit for 30 seconds or so and then it will keep running. The gear oil in the trans it new too. Yours sounds a bit extreme Tercel_jon.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by Tercel__jon » Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:02 pm

It was crazy weird. Then again it never gets that cold here. Its that freak winter storm. I had a bottle of gear oil in the back of my truck and it was pretty much solid. 10 degrees sure is something....we dont hardly see 25 usually.

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dlb
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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by dlb » Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:27 pm

marlene, are you running traditional oil too?

atoyot's comment...
atoyta wrote:I had the trans rebuilt & ran it with the normal 80/90w oil for the first 500 miles & then replaced it with the Redline. It did shift better in cold weather with the synthetic.
has pretty much sold me on going full synthetic on the next trans/diff oil change.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by marlinh » Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:36 pm

Yes I am running 80/W90. On cold days, sometimes it is also hard to shift into second. So I do a 1st to 3rd shift, and after a short bit of driving it shifts fine. I have read most of the posts on the different oils people use but am not sure which option is best. That stuff isn't cheap, so experimenting would get expensive.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by dlb » Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:49 pm

agreed on the expense of experimenting. when i go for it, i will likely go with marshall's recommendation of redline's 75-90 NS stuff. i have had the same concerns about finding a synthetic suitable for our synchros and hypoid gears but it sounds like 75-90 NS has worked well for him. here's an old post of his on it.

http://www.tercel4wd.com/viewtopic.php? ... 885#p43503

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by splatterdog » Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:10 pm

Tercel__jon wrote:So I just want to toss this info out there...what with my running 80w-90 traditional and our stupid low temperatures we've had teh last few days here in north carolina. The gear oil is so thick, the car wouldnt start. Had to hold the clutch down. After the engine was warm I let it out in neutral and the car tried to move forward...and promptly stalled. Restart...made sure it was in neutral...let it out annnnd tried to move forward and stall. Restart, rev up to about 4k. Dump the clutch (in neutral) and floored it. It bogged down to about 1500rpm and then recovered. Held it to about 2k rpm for a few minutes until it would idle. That shows how thick gear oil gets in 10 degree weather. I didnt bother driving the car since Ive got the same stuff in the diff.

On the flip side of this, I have the same gear oil in the trans of my f150. No problems. Then again its a simple 3 speed and thus has less parts than the tercel trans.

Well thats my experience. Ill be going 50/50 traditional and synthetic with the lightest weight oil I can find for next winter. Though it doesnt usually get down that low here.
Had -20-30's do the same thing with synthetic! Killed the engine a few times then I revved er up and dumped the clutch. The car lurched(in neutral) as the fluid broke free. I have used both regular synthetic and redline ns. Really haven't noticed much of a difference. I've got bulk syn in my winter beater and it works fine. I was going to just use it as a flush fluid. If it doesn't work NS, would be the next step. The only shifting trouble I've had is getting back in first without a complete stop when cold. And that's been on all of them.

Syn is all I feed my T4's, even being one of the cheapest drivers around.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by atoyta » Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:38 am

Just remember any bad seals will be more prone to leak with synthetic.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by c_j » Thu Jan 09, 2014 10:18 pm

marlinh wrote:Yes I am running 80/W90. On cold days, sometimes it is also hard to shift into second. So I do a 1st to 3rd shift, and after a short bit of driving it shifts fine. I have read most of the posts on the different oils people use but am not sure which option is best. That stuff isn't cheap, so experimenting would get expensive.
I experience the same trouble shifting into second on cold days, so it takes a lot of effort to get second gear, or much easier to do the same as marlinh and go 1st to 3rd.

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dlb
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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by dlb » Thu Jan 09, 2014 10:30 pm

i have the same issue with tough shifting into 2nd until the car warms up. i usually just start in 2nd unless i'm facing uphill.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by Mad_Marx » Fri Jan 10, 2014 3:48 pm

I've been running redline 75-90 at the recomendation of 4wdchico, very happy with it, no problems in cold weather, even when we were at -10 F here.

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by yodasrus » Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:22 am

I am using Mystic JT-7
It is a 80w-90 non synthetic but has helped this problem with my Tercels

The key is to shift them slowly and gently until they are fully warmed up

Hope this helps

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Re: unhappy with 80w-90 gear oil

Post by The Professor » Thu Nov 12, 2015 8:28 am

I finished swapping out the gear oil in my Tercel's transmission and rear axle with 80w/90. The old oil looked to be in pretty good condition, it was a dark amber and didn't smell as awful as black, ancient gear oil. Ditto on the rear axle.

Before, the trans would shift OK, but would nip the gears a little on the 1-2 and 2-3 upshifts. After the fluid swap 3rd gear will grind if you hustle the upshift. It's fine if you shift slowly and smoothly. I drove it a few miles and things didn't seem get any better. I'll have to go for a longer drive to see if higher temps help the shifting, but as for now, I'm considering draining out a quart or so and tossing in a quart of synthetic, as suggested.

Also, does anyone know the name of the engineer who designed this transmission? I have a few choice words for him. If you're familiar with Subarus, they have essentially the same engine/transmission layout as a Tercel. The difference is, the front diff is internal to the transmission case, there is only one drain plug, and, gasp, a dipstick and fill tube!

FHI>TMC on mid-80s transmission design...
1975 Subaru SuperStar wagon
1984 Subaru Turbo-Traction wagon
1996 Subaru SVX LSi
1999 Subaru Forester S
2002 Subaru WRX sedan

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