What kind of oil do you recommend?

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BaileySims
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What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by BaileySims »

What kind of oil do you use in your Terc? I've recently got done with replacing every gasket and seal on my 83 terc. Threw on a weber carb and added oil. I put a 10 40w of full synthetic by Pennzoil I believe it was. Started and ran fine for awhile until I spun a rod bearing. Since then, I'm tore apart my car once more to replace the rod and main bearings. Yeah, I should have done if when I had the motor out the first time but I was tight on cash and just wanted to drive my baby again. I'm on or about in the 189k miles range on the motor and I just wanted to know what kind of motor oil you guys recommend. Thanks.
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dlb
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by dlb »

10w30 is the manufacturer's spec for most temps. why did you go with 10w40? not that i imagine it made much difference--it probably would have spun the bearing regardless of 10w30 or 10w40.

in any engines that leak or burn oil, i use whatever oil is on sale but i do oil and filter changes every 5000 km on all our vehicles, or once a year if the vehicle sees less than 5000 km/year. i also use toyota's own oil filters. i get them from the dealer and they're about on par with most of the big name filters.
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by irowiki »

Yup, if it burns or leaks, it gets whatever is cheap. Actually on my oil leaker, I found it leaked less with 20w-50.

I try to use synthetic on cars that don't burn or leak.
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Petros
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by Petros »

the owner manual remcomments 20s-50 if over 70 deg F outside temp. in Texas in summer it should get something much thicker than 10w-30.

but 10w-40 would not have caused the bearing damage, likely it had low oil pressure from worn bearings and likely a worn oil pump. keep the 20w-50 in it at least for those long hot Texas summers...7 to 9 months of the year.
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BaileySims
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by BaileySims »

Appreciate the replys. I'm not entirely too sure of what oil I'd want to use. I put 10 40 in all of my vehicles, except the motorcycles of course. I just found it really odd that after the engine pull and clean along with the oil change that the bearing went out. Prior to that, I have been driving the car just fine for about 4 months. As of this point in time, I have 4 mains and three rods out and they look perfectly fine. I'm hoping that the last rod was causing the problem, if not, what would knock? A valve? I put my trust in the head mechanics diagnosis, so I'm hoping he's right about the rods. I have also figured that I probably cannot do all the bearings in frame like I thought so everything is going to have to come out today. Another noob question, how do I post pictures of my car in replies and such? Thanks.
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dlb
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by dlb »

check #18 in the FAQ for posting pics on the forum.

https://tercel4wd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7442

the knock could also be caused by a damaged piston skirt. if the engine was still together, you could hook up an oil pressure gauge. worn out bearings will often cause low oil pressure on idle.
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by Petros »

the number three and four rod bearings are furthermost from the oil pump (even more than the rear main) though the oil galleys, and it gets damaged if ever it runs low on oil. So likely at some point the oil was low and the rear most rod bearings were oil starved. the mains are almost always in good shape, so I have just replaced the rod bearings with standard size without issues. this is the only way you will wipe out only the rear most rod bearings. If all the bearings are worn out it is an indication the it was run with dirty/gritty oil, it would also wear out the oil pump.

if the journal is damaged from running dry, usually you can hand polish it with first 400 than 600 or 800 grit wet and dry paper strips with solvent. wrap a thick cord around the sand paper and journal several turns and pull the cord back and fourth. get it to where the lines are just removed, check the size (it does not have to be perfect, just smooth). If within spec put in standard bearings.

if you put new bearings in with damaged journals it will just shred the new bearings too, so make sure you polish them first. You do not even have to remove the crank to do it, just make sure you clean everything off good when you are done. I have even done this with the engine still in the car.

good luck.
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BaileySims
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by BaileySims »

Alright guys, one last question. I put the rods and mains back in and I never turned the crank when I was done. The crank was locked up maybe because I over torqued the bearings. I had the mains at 47lbs and the rods at 32lbs. I had to pull the oil pan off and loosen everything just to get the crank to spin. What do I torque everything down to for the crank to spin fine? Or do you think I have the wrong sized bearings? I'm stumped. I'm not sure if they have been done before either so I don't know if the crank was polished or anything. The old bearings I bought have an "std" stamped on them so I ordered standard bearings. Thanks for the help.


Edit:

Tell me that whoever owned the car before only polished down this part of the crank. 1 2 and 4 read 2<20 and rod 3 reads 3<20. I'm assuming that one bearing is either smaller or bigger than the rest. Torqued down all mains and rods besides number 3 rod and it span freely. This is really grinding my gears.
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by xirdneh »

seems to me over torqueing the bolts a bit would not cause tightness on the bearings
did you check the bearing clearances with plastigage?
i always check new bearing clearance to make sure they are under max tolerance
it would also tell if they are too tight
Love those Tercell 4x4 wagons but they sure suffer from road noise.
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Petros
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by Petros »

sounds like wrong bearings to me too. you will not change the dia of the bearings by over torquing the caps, it only compresses the cap into the seat, not change the shape of the bore the bearings are in.

do the plastige test as suggested by Xirdneh. if only one does not have enough clearance than perhaps you can polish it by hand until it gets to the right size. you use a strip of 400 grit wet and dry wrapped around the bearing, loop a thick cord around it several times, with solvent on the journal, and than tug the cord back and forth like sawing a log. it will take it off nice and evenly only a tiny bit at a time.
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'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by teranfirbt »

I would do a check to see if you just have one bearing sticking or multiples... I had an issue once where I heli-coiled the cam bolts on a 22RE head and didn't notice a flake of metal in the journal before torquing. Cam was locked up with all caps down, but when I loosened that one it freed up. Found the flake of metal and all was good.
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by BaileySims »

Well gentlemen, sorry for all the stuff i've been asking. I took the head off today and apparently one of the damn springs on the rocker arm had broken a piece off and fell into the valve and into the cylinder. It was mashing the hell out of the piston and it is completely trashed. I'll try and post a picture in an edit as soon as i get back to my house later on. Another question is, where can i buy those springs for the rocker arm assembly? I already bought a new piston and head gasket. The cylinder wall is unharmed as well as all the piston rings. It kind of looks like if you were to put a piston into a blender. Haha!
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by xirdneh »

the spring pieces cannot get into the cylinders
without a spring or with a partial spring the valve would probably hang down too low and pound the top of the piston
Love those Tercell 4x4 wagons but they sure suffer from road noise.
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BaileySims
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by BaileySims »

It wasn't a valve spring, it was those springs on the rocker arm assembly. She's running well again after replacing the piston, just have a tiny oil leak from the oil pan gasket. The bottom of the head was scuffed quite a bit from that steel piece, but she's still marching on. :)
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Petros
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Re: What kind of oil do you recommend?

Post by Petros »

so please explain how a piece of a spring from the rocker arm assembly can get INSIDE the cylinder?

more likely the carb lost a part, or something was dropped down the intake. or I have seen a peice of an exhaust valve break off and cause damage like that (usually much more severer, and badly damaging the parts).
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
'01 Honda Civic (other daughter's daily driver)
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