Bike Advice?

kingtercel · Post by **kingtercel** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:30 pm

Im lookin into getting a bike for long distance road/ track riding - for cross country type rides,
I am probably looking more towards a mountain style for asian countryside touring or for up in the hills but need the flexibility of road/ speed aswell,

I got an american 'HASA' last year, excellent bike for alround use, but its probly too small for me long distance ( 20'' frmae i think) as i am 6'3".

The bike will be riden with back panniers, as im sik of an extra 20 kilos of back pack weight onto the seat (extemly unpleasant especialy over rocky ground)
and hopefully ill be able to buy the bike from some sort of wholesaler operation (keep the price down) - qualtiy and therefore reliability are a must for long isolated rides

i figured tercel owners would have heaps of experience in bicycles as they both hold similar power ratings, have a go-anywhere attitude and from time to time you have to resort to using one, as the other is chuckin a sicky

cheers

MootsMan · Post by **MootsMan** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:44 pm

well, now.....have you ever come to the right place !! both myself and Archnstl have extensive bike riding and selling experience....he probably more that myself. I'm pretty much of a roadie myself, although I do have a couple of decent mtn. bikes. I don't have a clue what the terrain is like there in Australia where you are. When you say long distance road, are you talking about something that will take several days/weeks to accomplish ?? If you need something that will carry panniers, I'd definitely suggest a specific touring bike, as they are designed with a slightly longer wheelbase frame, to make the ride more comfortable, as well as distribute the weight of your packs out so the bike will be more stable. Typically, they are equipped with some mtn. bike componetry, as well as mtn. bike gearing ( larger cogs in the back, triple chain rings up front), which gives you a better set-up for carrying larger loads ( i.e. - more "stuff" than just the rider )

I am not sure what brands you have available to you there down under. We sold Trek bikes at the store I'm working at a few years ago, and they had a specific touring model. I really like the Litespeed Blue Ridge for touring purposes, though....it's a great bike. Full titanium frame, and should be an awesomely comfortable bike for long bike tours. Pricey, but something that will last a long time.

Hope this helps. If you have specific questions, I'll be glad to try and help.

mm

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 10:19 pm

Too bad you're in AUS. I have maybe 20 bikes around. Road bikes, Mountain Bikes... Though which ones are even remotely in tact or available for sale (dads a bit of a packrat) is questionable.

kingtercel · Post by **kingtercel** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 10:21 pm

Yeh we get Trek over here, where du they sit in price range and industry recognition?
We get all the larger brand bikes, but alot more asian than american bikes

I was hoping to get several types of track from the one bike so i could set out with little notice.
Terrain in around perth hills is rocky, rutts, gravel and sand (too much sand)
But the trips i have planned lately have been for
- a road ride over to the east coast next winter (wind behind me) should
should take 6-8 weeks
- Possibly a SE asian trip from india to vietnam within the next year/s (out
of built up road areas into rural tracks and regions - take tent etc) over
a month or 2
and pretty much anywhere in WA with the flexibility to grab the well maintained touring bike with little plans but heaps of motivation and get somewhere on food and water, instead of fuel - im slowly building up equipment necassary for such trips

is there such thing as a long wheelbase mountainbike (off road touring bike)?
where abouts does the hybrid bike sit in relation to long distance road (and off road) ??

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 11:05 pm

Well, a lot of the mountain bikes I have are the same wheelbase as the tourers. I have one BMX (Bicycle Moto-Cross) bike which is super-short wheelbase. I don't like it.
I've ridden 10 miles on a mountain bike... Knobby tires generate more resistance. The tires I use don't give a bumpy ride though. Just a lot more resistance.

Just saw a commercial for Discovery Channel's Discover Australia... Have to see how it stacks up.

BTW, one of the Eddie Bauer baby models for Australia is my niece. Shes on a carseat and crib liner if I remember right... Shes here in Colorado, but her pics will be on some Australian Eddie Bauer Baby products.

Totally random point wasn't that.

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 11:18 am

I have a Mongoose mountain bike, but I can't remember if it's a 21" frame. I hardly ever ride it because I can only fit it in the Tercel unassembled with one seat down. I would like to put it to the test in the mountains, but with the resistance of the tires it is hard for me to get going past the lower gears. It also doesn't help the the front tire rim is bent, I should have it straightened out soon.

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 2:48 pm

I used to have one with a speedo unit. My cruise was about 28mph and I once reached 54mph downhill. Holy crap is all I can say to that... My dads also used to have a speedo, till someone pilferred it... He cruised about 39mph on his Schwinn 16-speed... Fastest he ever got was 65 I think.... How, I do not know.... Though, he used to do cross-country biking in his younger years. He once rode from Phoenix, Arizona up to Spokane, Washington, then back through Colorado to Arizona. Thats not a small distance... How he did it... I have no idea...

A few summers back I used to ride an average of 20 miles a day every day. I'd on a whim jump on the bike and cruise over to my buddies house 5 miles away, chill for a while, come home, then go back.

Speaking of that friend... I wonder if I could ride my bike down to the Springs....? That just might give them a scare... I show up on a bicycle after a 200-ish mile trip. Getting there might not be too bad... A lot of downhill... Coming back though... x.x

tercel4wdrules · Post by **tercel4wdrules** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:50 pm

A nice bike ride would be through the Angeles Crest Highway, but it's closed at Islip Saddle, forty miles away from where it commences. Another ride that would be nice in my opinion would be Little Tujunga Canyon Road out of Lake View Terrace, CA. I think I can cruise at 25 mph with the Mongoose. I was doing 19 mph in a children's bike a few years ago. I was on a bike trail and someone was riding besides me and clocked me in at 19 mph. It was bally scary though as I was swaying side to side (I was too tall for the bike) and literally I was giving it all I had. I still have the bike, except it has a flat tire. I've grown a few more inches since then (probably a good 4-6") and I can no longer even sit in it correctly.

I remember someone told me he was able to do 50 mph down a stretch of highway with a really light bike he had put together himself. Unfortunately, someone in a car hit him and it bent the bike up. He was okay.

Mickey_D · Post by **Mickey_D** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 5:00 pm

In my younger years I was given a speeding ticket by the British Columbia RCMP while I was on my bike.

Mind you, both my brother and I were riding on velodromes at the time and I had my fixed wheel racing bike......

Still, 54 in a 35 was a hefty fine for a 16 year old at that time!!

Gives you an idea how old I am that BC was still using miles instead of kilometers at the time

Post by **Mattel** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 8:00 pm

Hey King Tercel,

I'd reccomend a good light mountainbike frame and reliable componants with two sets of tires. Don't get suspension for your needs, it adds weight, cost and unnessary resistance when on the road. use the money saved for good componants.

I would not really worry about disk brakes either, a well set up pair of canteleivers or v-brakes do a good job. If there on the bike that your looking at then it's a bonus

My GT avalanche is 11 years old and has the necessary braise ons the back drop outs for my carrier. this bike was about $1600 aus back in '96 but you can pick up the same thing for about $500-$800. It's been used everyday almost and still has original components (Shimana LX), wheels and so forth.

I use it every day for commuting in the city with road tyres on it, on weekends it often gets a run with some knobblies down the local tracks. I've also done some cycle touring, including 14 days in Vietnam and plan on Tasmania soon.

I wholeheartdly reccomend a good strong light alloy mountain bike frame and high end componants. With a set of Road tyres or knobblies for off the tracks Then you can have a bike that is practical for all occasions.

good luck with it!

Typrus · Post by **Typrus** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 10:11 pm

If you jump on carbon fiber, just remember to store it dry. They don't like to stay wet. Minus tires they are lighter'n snot though....

Post by **ARCHINSTL** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 10:52 pm

I liked the reference that Mattel made to his GT Avalanche - my store was one of the first to carry GT little bikes back in the late '70s and also one of the first with the big bikes in the '80s, and we were usually the top producer here in STL for the company - great bikes. The Avalanche was always a good seller-an affordable version of the Zaskar. A number of ex-employees went on to careers with the old (real) GT company, and Richard Long, the dynamic co-founder of the company, was a personal friend
I digress...

I would agree that a full-on touring bike would be the best for your road excursions: long wheelbase for stability and carrying capacity, canti/V-brakes instead of disc for weight and simplicity/ability to fix out in the boonies and a triple crank with a wide-range rear cassette and, of course, a long cage derailleur and no shock stuff. This is pretty much what MootsMan and Mattel recommended. And use dropped bars, which was not mentioned, unless you have neck/lower back issues. Stay with at least 36 (straight-gauge) SS spokes in the front and rear, and possibly 40 in the rear, depending on your weight and the weight of what you will be carrying. Make sure that there are provisions for braze-on mounts for front and rear pannier racks so you can avoid using clamps, which can loosen and slip.
Avoid fancy wheels/weird spoking patterns: remember, you will be in the boonies and the nearest store just might not carry unusual parts.
Also - see my note in a following paragraph on having the frame capability of using wide tires - for your purposes perhaps more for stability and comfort and carrying capacity.

When I built what I suppose would be my "final" bike (boy - that sounds terminal...) before closing the shop, I wanted a wide range gearing system, but with using my old DuraAce racing crank from the early '80s (sentiment), for the shifting ease of a double and yet a really wide range. So - I did a 39-48 on the front and a 12-32 XTR 8-speed cassette on the rear. My range, still with a double, is 33 to 108 gear inches, which is plenty for STL and environs and yet suits my, ummm, mature physical presence (No, I don't have a gut - just verifying the presence of gravity).
I also put this on a GT hybrid aluminum frame for two reasons, the first being that I wanted a not-quite touring wheelbase, but yet not a shortie road frame, and yet have the capability of using cantis (not V-brakes).
The second and almost important reason for the hybrid frame with its wider spacing in the fork and rear triangle is that I had a favorite pair of Mavic MA-40 rims I had been saving for years, and they can safely mount everything from a 700x23 to a 700x32 tire size: The former for speed (Ha-once upon a time, maybe...), and the latter for kinda comfort (I can run the Tioga City Slickers at a non-recommended pressure of 110+ to down around around 75 psi for a smooth ride over tough pavement). This particular (and most) hybrid frames can run up to at least a 700x38 and some to even a 700x40-42 tire size. I also use dropped bars and an adjustable stem, for when the aero feeling is getting to be a pain (literally).

However - I am not touring, as you will be.
Truck (as some in the trade called "Trek") makes good stuff, but I would think there would be a domestic company which might specialize in what you are looking to use over your vast distances, which I think in Europe might be called a trekking bike?

Keep us advised of your progress and decisions - in addition to MootsMan and DirtMagnet and myself, there is a new member, SHOCK79, who is in the trade here in the USA.
Tom M.

MootsMan · Post by **MootsMan** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:45 pm

My first "good" mtn. bike was the GT Avalanche, about the same vintage as Mattel's.....I bought mine in December of '95 as a closeout '95model. It was polished aluminum, and did it ever look good....all nice and shiny there in the store.....until the first couple of rides outdoors, then it dulled up rather quickly. Nothing that a good rub with some Mother's Alum. polish and good old fashioned elbow grease wouldn't cure.

Currently, I am riding titanium bikes, and have been since my first Moots road bike back in '99. They are incredible rides, and I think would be esp. good for long bike touring. I have done several rides of 100+ miles over the last 7 years, and the ti has never caused me a problem. I have Moots road and mtn. bikes, Litespeed and Colnago road bikes, and a NukeProof ti mtn. bike (which I believe was made by LiteSpeed ). All in all, titanium is stiff ( how much so depends on how the mfgr. designs the frame), comfortable, DURABLE, and lightweight. Of all the bikes I have and have had, the Moots is hands down my favorite. Those guys there in Steamboat Springs really know how to build a bicycle frame.

For the kind of riding you're talking about , a nice bike would be well worth the investment. If you look on ebay and places like that ( roadbikereview.com, etc. ) you can find a great deal on a ti bike. I helped a friend of mine find one....he purchased a 3yr old Lemond Titanium road bike with mostly DuraAce components that probably didntn' have 1000 miles on it, for $1500US. That was a great deal in my opinion.

Post by **ARCHINSTL** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 11:05 pm

I do agree with MootsMan on titanium: It is truly the miracle metal, at least for bicycles. It has a very nice, smooth ride, unlike aluminum, and of course, does not rust and is very light.

The downside, as far as I am concerned, and why I did not mention it, is a quite high initial cost (you did not mention cost). A possible other negative factor, which I really would not worry about, is that if something breaks/cracks/bends in the Outback, is that it does take rather specialized welding/cutting/threading/bending equipment that the "village blacksmith" may not have.
That said - don't worry about it unless you trash bikes.

If you are interested in converting a mountain bike - go for an older model - kinda pre-1990 in general, because if will have a longer wheelbase and longer chain stays and a more laid-back head tube angle and fork. Stay with steel for comfort. You will also have an investment in gearing, as stock ATB ranges are usually much too low for road use of any duration (unless you are, of course, climbing mountain roads all of the time).
Tom M.

kingtercel · Post by **kingtercel** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 9:20 pm

Cheers for all the advice, there almost seems to be a larger knowledge base of bikes than terks in this forum! I thought i was completely bike savy before exploring the elements of building one

Ive been working out costs and my cash situation, and am willing to spend up to AUS 1000 for initial parts;
but of course these things tend to create enthusiasm which sees me working some overtime for some high priced accessories
Beleive me if i had the cash i would go for a koga miyata or something ridiculous, which would outlive me

I like the idea of using an old frame and givingnew life with all new drive and gears, it means i will be completely proficient with every part of the bike for future problems / replacements, but i dont like the sound of a steel frame,
Would a 10-15 year old frame hold up well? without thread wear or any serious creep occuring in the frame?

Titanium sounds great, but the initial cost is definately a deciding factor,
My main interest would be in a long wheelbase frame ( and possibly some drop bars) but in a mountainbike format ( no shocks) a new frame would be great to start with (apaerntly) nil problems but if a second hand frame will suffice with adequate reliability then its just a case of figuring what frame style and finding it

this Litespeed blue ridge tourer, is that capable in soft offroading - rocky?

I was convinced that a cyclocross bike would be ideal until i considered carrying weight design and long range reliability

Ilike the sound of the gt avalanche, has it come out with a large wheelbase sze?
What is a touring wheelbase size; compared to an average bike?

the GT hybrid sounds good with the wide forks, as flexibility in ride is definately what im after
Tom M - these Mavic rims sound great for wide tyre range, what specifications allow this? Id say quality rims is definately something i will invest in due to theunbeleivable irritation of having bent rims against the brakes

The frame needs good carrying capacity strength, what are these braze on mounts? are they just welded on to any frame, or incororated into the frae design??

In terms of the gearing, i generally only use the top 3 gears around home but i suppose rough terrain touring with panniers will require the lower range, but getting the highest range cassette is goin to be a priority.
What r the benefits of a 'long cage' derailler?

Hey Mattel what was vietnam like?? did yuo ride roads or was it out on rural tracks?
What setup did utake / would recommend? (australian bike references if possible)

Reliable components is going to be the essence of this bike, does that just mean upgraded /expensive shimano parts or is there a different pool for quality stuff?

Thanks for the help
Kingtercel