TVSV ruminations

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waynehoc
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TVSV ruminations

Post by waynehoc »

Finally got around to testing the TVSV on my '87 2WD wagon, which is the identical part number as in ARCHINSTL's TVSV post(s). As well, the TVSV from my '86 4-dr parts car is also the identical part number. And, in fact the '86 TVSV is now installed in my '87 wagon as it tested much better that the one that was in there.

Here are pics showing what should be the results of testing at various temps

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The results I got are as follows -

Did not test by cooling to below 7C (45F) as with both TVSV's at room temp, the below 45F/baseline condition was already present.

Both TVSV's switched to the 17C-50C (63F-122F) condition at approx 102F, and both switched to the above 68C (154F) condition at approx 173F. The '86 unit switched a few degrees sooner, in both cases, than the '87 unit. A bit high, compared to what a new unit would likely switch?

There was a problem though, with both units, at both switching points, and the '87 was far worse, so it got taken out of use and the '86 installed in its place. Incidentally, both units are from vehicles with approx 250,000km/150,000 miles on the clock.

The problem was this, that at both points, there was a transition range of close to 5 degrees F ('86 unit) and closer to 10 degrees F ('87 unit) where BOTH the 'K' (vacuum port) AND the 'J' (atmospheric port) were connected simultaneously to whatever port they were supposed to be switching away from/switching to. Bottom line = there was a vacuum leak from atmosphere (J) to vacuum (K) during this transition time. In the case of the '86 unit the 'leak' was very minimal, but in the case of the '87 unit the 'leak' was very considerable, and lasted longer, to boot.

Another thing I noticed with both units was that the vacuum port 'K' did not totally 'disconnect' from the AAP port 'N' until approx 190 degrees F. This means that the AAP was still functional with a quite warm engine = unnecessary richness beyond where necessary/desireable? As it appears (with my massive sample of two TVSV's) that a common failure mode (with age) of the TVSV is that all switching functions tend to move to higher temps, that in an extreme case of this type af age-related 'failure', one could end up with a condition where the AAP is always active = excessive fuel consumption on acceleration/overall poorer gas mileage, even with a brand new carb installed?

I've temporarily plugged my AAP vac line, as another member mentioned doing in one post, to see if it really makes any difference when the engine is cold. In my case it doesn't seem to have done anything too much, but temps are above freezing right now, and we seldom get extremely cold weather. Will be interested to see how it goes if we get a cold snap.

Another thing I found in my case, was a leaking CO (Choke Opener) diaphragm = questionable/erratic EGR operation? - as the CO and EGR line both come off the 'M' port of the TVSV.

For now, I have temporarily plugged off the line to the CO as I don't have a spare to install. And, in fact, it makes no difference running with the line plugged as my choke still opens fully anyway. The carb on my '86 parts car doesn't even have a CO, just the CB (choke breaker) and heated electric choke.

Bottom line - TVSV - potential big problem (especially if you have to pass smog) - but how necessary is it?
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ARCHINSTL
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Post by ARCHINSTL »

VERY interesting article - Thanks!
I wonder - did all of Toyota's x AC engines for various destinations over the many years have the TVSV? Is it only on emissions-committed x AC engines - or only on Aisan-equipped engines? Same part, regardless of destination country?
Did any Weber-folk disconnect their TVSV? Mine, like other mature vehicles are exempt from emissions testing after August of '07 here in MO; lots of disconnects to pursue.
Mine was new in '05 (OE cracked/$90US), but will there be service-related problems years from now, and will they be available from Toy? Same part used on ___ models of Toyotas?
Tom M.

PS: I must say, our Club's members seem to write a lot of erudite papers - at least compared to TN or TO or (fill in the blank). This is a pretty neat place for a pretty neat car.
T4WD augury?
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takza
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Post by takza »

In my continual pursuit of mpg...I recently installed a manual choke in place of the working auto choke...because a previous member (3ACPower) mentioned a several mpg gain when his choke wasn't working vs a new auto replacement. This is an adventure.

I also set up the hot air door in the intake to pull vac directly from the manifold...causing it to pull hot air all the time unless over +1/2 throttle?

Put a magnet on the fuel line...neo40.

Removed heated fuel. Not good for a carbed car?

Might set up a system where the crankcase is under partial vacuum using the PCV system...this has gained a couple of mpg for some. Concerned about oil starvation to main/cam seals.

Plus a Condensator.

Now wanting to disable the AAP system...but I see removing the vac line basically enables it all the time....so I'm wondering how to disable it in such a way as to be able to make it work again if needed? Any ideas????

Could the cover be removed and the spring taken out??? Hoping I can use the choke during cold start conditions.
Give a boy a gun-give a biatch a cell phone-and pretty soon you almost got yourself a police state.

Orwell said: War is peace! Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength...

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waynehoc
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Post by waynehoc »

I also set up the hot air door in the intake to pull vac directly from the manifold...causing it to pull hot air all the time unless over +1/2 throttle?
About a year ago I had a day from #%$@&^ while out Christmas shopping because my HIC valve was dead leaving the hot air door to pull hot air ALL the time. Maybe in colder temps might be okay?
Now wanting to disable the AAP system...but I see removing the vac line basically enables it all the time....so I'm wondering how to disable it in such a way as to be able to make it work again if needed? Any ideas????
takza, unless I am reading the FSM wrong, disconnecting the vac line totally disables the AAP, and connecting the vac line enables it. See page EC-54 in the FSM.
waynehoc
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Post by waynehoc »

I wonder - did all of Toyota's x AC engines for various destinations over the many years have the TVSV? Is it only on emissions-committed x AC engines - or only on Aisin-equipped engines? Same part, regardless of destination country?
ARCHINSTL, check out this Google search of the Autozone site. It appears that a number of Toyotas have a TVSV, but not necessarily the same as ours.

http://www.google.ca/search?as_q=tvsv&h ... afe=images
waynehoc
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Post by waynehoc »

Okay, checked out that Autozone link carefully myself, and it appears that our wagons, '83 -'86 tercels, Corollas 1970 to 1997, and GM Prism/Nova (rebadged Toyotas) are equipped with our TVSV.

A search of the EPC reveals the same 90925-02076 part number for the following: 2A, 3A* and AL2* 82/05 thru 88/01; 4ALC/AE82 83/08 thru 87/07; 4AF/AE9* 87/05 thru 92/05; 4AF/AE92/MTM and 4AF/AE92/ATM/GL 90/08 thru 92/05; 4A/4AC/AE86 83/05 thru 87/04; and 4A*/AE71E 83/07 thru 87/07. And there could be more.

I forsee good trips to the jy's ahead, as all we have to do is look for what appears to be our TVSV, check the part # which is cast right into the body, and grab what looks to be good off the newest vehicle(s). Bring them home, test, and install the best...
Mac
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Post by Mac »

my tercel opens the bypass for the intake on all the time, so i always get warm air. so i plug it in in the winter and disconnect and plug it with a golf tee in the summer.
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takza
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Post by takza »

waynehoc wrote:takza, unless I am reading the FSM wrong, disconnecting the vac line totally disables the AAP, and connecting the vac line enables it. See page EC-54 in the FSM.
Well...the way I'm reading it...I think the spring enables it and vacuum disables it? :?: If the diaphram is OK...then full manifold vac should keep it OFF....or maybe just remove the spring.
Give a boy a gun-give a biatch a cell phone-and pretty soon you almost got yourself a police state.

Orwell said: War is peace! Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength...

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takza
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Post by takza »

Mac wrote:my tercel opens the bypass for the intake on all the time, so i always get warm air. so i plug it in in the winter and disconnect and plug it with a golf tee in the summer.
I had to find a new HIC valve in the JY maybe 2 yrs ago (from a later model Tercel)...I later measured the temp in the air cleaner at around 110F...but it takes a good while to get there in colder weather.

I'm messing around with full time hot air...had to add a spacer to the door at around 45F outside temps...was getting a little too warm. Aiming for 120F at cruise...maybe 140F at idle. Under WOT...I would be pulling cooler underhood air...since I removed the air tube to the front.

See no lack of power...seems a little smoother running.
Give a boy a gun-give a biatch a cell phone-and pretty soon you almost got yourself a police state.

Orwell said: War is peace! Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength...

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waynehoc
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Post by waynehoc »

Well...the way I'm reading it...I think the spring enables it and vacuum disables it? If the diaphram is OK...then full manifold vac should keep it OFF....or maybe just remove the spring.
How I see it is that to be enabled requires BOTH vacuum AND the spring, so diconnecting the vac line disables it.

I.e., at idle or fairly steady moderate throttle opening, the vacuum pulls the diaphragm back against the restraining force of the spring to 'load' the AAP, then when you accelerate the vacuum drops somewhat allowing the force of the spring to push the diaphragm ahead, thus 'shooting' some gas into the accel nozzzle. Backing off on the throttle somewhat will again 'load' the AAP diaphragm. The higher the vacuum, the more the AAP 'loads'.

With the vac line disconnected, the spring pushes the diaphragm out 'permanently', and without vacuum to pull the diaphragm back (against the resisting spring) to 'load' the AAP diaphragm there can be no AAP fuel discharge.

The AAP requires both the spring and vacuum to function as vacuum loads and the spring shoots. It is the changing vacuum in the manifold that allows the AAP to function - no (changing) vacuum = no AAP function. Disconnect the vac line = AAP disabled.
takza
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Post by takza »

Good thinking. Explains those 2 check balls in there.
Give a boy a gun-give a biatch a cell phone-and pretty soon you almost got yourself a police state.

Orwell said: War is peace! Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength...

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