What have you done to your wagon lately?

General discussion about our beloved Tercel 4WD cars
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BaileySims
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by BaileySims »

That's what I had thought it was at first. Upon further inspection the inner boot at popped off and all the grease is everywhere. When the sway bar bracket came off, the tire flew back and the cv knocked pretty hard on the body. There is no audible noise whatsoever from the cv while at full lock in both directions. I'll pull the cv today and see what the problem is. Thanks for the info peter.
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4wdEconoBox
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by 4wdEconoBox »

So, I checked out everything under my car today, and found two issues.. My passenger side output shaft seal is leaking a good bit, I've ordered new seals and while I was underneath I topped up my transmission fluid. I also noticed that my drivers side cv axle is really loose inside the transmission.... As in it pulls out very easily, at least a half inch or so, and with a tiny amount of force, I would imagine I can pull it completely out... Is that normal? Because it doesn't sound like it to me.... It looks to be the original axle, but there isn't any rotational movement from it at all from what I can tell. I am replacing the passenger side axle when I replace its seal in a week or so. The one that's in there is only about 2 years old, but it was a reman and never was completely silent from day one, I'll be getting a new gsp one this time.... Ohh, and good luck with all your issues as well Bailey!
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by Petros »

"passenger side input shaft"? do you mean the cv axle seal on the front diff? that is the output shaft (output to the front wheels).

The trans input shaft is the one on the front of the trans that inserts into the clutch, and there is no "passenger side", there is only one on the center line. Just clearing up your terminology. you can not see it without pulling the trans.

It is normal for the cv axle to be able to slip in and out about 1/4", they are on a spline with a spring clip that holds them in. it does not take too much to pop them out, a lever or large screw driver usually does it. if the spring clip is weak or worn out it is possible the spline shaft will pop out, it would leak very badly if that is the case. these clips are usually very reliable and work good enough. If you replace your cv axles you will get new spring clips. check for slop or wear in the cv axles, if there is too much rotational play in the joints they should be replaced, it is just a matter of time before they go bad and could fail.
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4wdEconoBox
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by 4wdEconoBox »

Ohh ok, I got you, my bad haha, but yeah thats what I meant! Ohh ok, I honestly didn't know that, makes me feel a little better now at least! There is definitely a good bit of rotational play in my passenger side axle, but the drivers side one seems to be alright for the time being, I'll probably buy a new drivers side one once I save up some money, just to have it. Thanks for the helpful info!!
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by Petros »

they go on sale at Rockauto.com regularly, I can usually get new ones (not remans) for about $60 each. When I see that I will buy a set just to have.

Funny thing is it seems there is always someone on the forum that is near by that needs new ones, so I end up installing them on someone else's Tercel4wd before I get to use them. So I reguarly check Rockauto for a good deal on cv axles. Locally they can only get re manufactured cv axles at the auto parts stores, half are junk right out of the box. do not use remans unless you have no other choice.
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by 4wdEconoBox »

Ohh yeah, they're on sale right now, the gsp ones, which they don't specify new or remans, but the passenger side was one $28 and some change, and then Surtrack/Trackmotive drivers and passengers side are a little less than $40 a piece, but none say whether they're new or remans, they don't ask for a core charge though, so hopefully they're new! I got one of the gsp ones, I figure for $30 it was worth a shot!

Yeah, I definitely know about the remans being garbage, the passenger side one that I'm about to replace was a reman and was bad since I put it in...
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by Petros »

I think GSP are remans only. check over the listing, it should say somewhere (they cleverly hide it). the EMPI ones are new, they cost more, but still a great price.

Not all the remans are bad, but many are. I ordered a set locally because they could get them in one day at NAPA. They were Cardone (which rockauto also carries). I took them out of the box in the store when they came in, and rotated each of the joints by hand, one was perfect. the other felt like grinding metal and sand paper inside the boot. I told the emplyee to send it back and get another. the store owner came over (who I knew, I prepared his house plans). He felt it and said "you know it will probably wear in", he runs their machine shop in the back, I know he knew better. I said to him "every time the wheel turns that cv joint rotates around like that...how long do you think it would last feeling like that right out of the box?" he said he will get me another one, no argument. So one out of two was junk. Synth has found about 3 out of 4 bad for the Cardone remans.

so far I have never found a bad one with the new Empi axles. Unfortunately they are made in China, but empi has been around a long time and has a good repution, so perhaps they are made to their standards. so far so good with every Empi I have used.
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by ARCHINSTL »

If GSP are remans, I would be surprised!
Mine were new, and as recently as 2015, the GSP that Advance was carrying were new.
Call GSP at 1-800-243-7225 (Jason Lopez was my contact) or email CustomerService@gspnorthamerica.com
Website mentions only new and it is http://us.gsp.cn/main/
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Mark
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by Mark »

One thing I found out recently regarding re-manufactured axles, is that the way they're put together usually makes them impossible to disassemble. I noticed that the outer boots on my '81 Tercel were recently torn. They still had most of the clean grease in them so I thought I'd save a few dollars and just re-pack and replace the boots. To slide on a new boot, the CV end has to come off. The CV end should slide off the rest off the axle since they are held together by splines. I noticed that on my re-manufactured ones, the splines were mis-matched and just pressed together (probably with a hydraulic press). I tried heating and a puller, but there was no way they were coming apart. I ended up putting those ridiculous split boots on them for now. Local re-man axles are around $120 each and about the same for Rockauto's when we factor in shipping to Canada. I have a spare set of 2nd gen Tercel drive axles sitting around, but they don't fit the 1st gen cars.
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by rer233 »

outer joint doesn't come apart- you have to disassemble the inner joint to replace the outer boot.
if it aint there, there's a good chance it won't break!
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by Mark »

I can't remember now if it was the inner or outer joint, but mine all had splines like in this random internet picture:
122150L.gif
The splines on the shaft and in the thing called the "tripod" were mismatched and pressed together on the re-man axles.
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by Petros »

tom, that is good to know about the GSP axles! Happy to be corrected.

so at $28 for a new GSP axle sounds like a great bargain. I should buy a few!
'87 Tercel 4wd SR5 (current engine swap project)
'84 Tercel 4wd (daily driver, with on going mods)
'92 Mazda MPV 4wd (wife's daily driver)
'85 Tercel 4wd DLX auto(daughter's daily driver)
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by 4wdEconoBox »

Well that definitely makes me feel better Tom! I wish they would have had drivers side axles because I would've definitely bought one of those also!

Edit: And from researching the Surtrack/Trakmotive axles it seems that they are new also. Well it says all of their axles are "built from the ground up" so I assume that means new, plus a few forums said they were build beefier than originals, I'm not sure if that applies to our application or not though. If anyone has any experience with them let us know! At $40 they would be worth checking out also!
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by BaileySims »

Cv was the culprit. This is the inner side. I am having a really hard time getting the other end out of the transmission right now. I am bending pry bars and it is simply not budging. Anyone ever experience this before?
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4wdEconoBox
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Re: What have you done to your wagon lately?

Post by 4wdEconoBox »

I definitely have, me and my buddy had a hell of a time getting one out of his car... I can't remember how we ended up getting it out though.... I wanna say we used two prybars on opposite sides and both of us pushing at the same time for a while worked, I think we spun the axle a few times too, thinking it would move the c clamp around, good luck though brotha!

On another note, my axle and seals came in, they sent me the wrong seals though.... They don't have the lip on them even though I specifically looked and ordered the ones with the lip.... Guess this has to be put off some more..... Unless yall think these will work? They look like cam seals honestly though...

Edit: This is what they look like.... They fit on the axle, but like i said they don't have the lip... And I ordered nationals but they came in carquest boxes with no branding stamps on the seals.... I'm pretty sure nationals say "national" on the seal don't they?!

Image
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